Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

Author Topic: Tena Bar Money Find  (Read 554759 times)

Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5700 on: November 10, 2020, 06:33:06 PM »
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I do not have the evidence but you cannot counter it either. He was back there fiddling about for at least 20 minutes after ordering Tina to the cockpit right?  So who knows what he was doing?  Perhaps putting on thermal underwear?  I do not buy into this 57 below zero crap either.  It might have been the wind chill for a split second or two when he jumped?  But that would be it. It was not even snowing. It was rain.  It was not upstate NY.  He could have had other things under that fake bomb.  Survival gear?
First off, let’s deal with known facts as I lived in Portland in 1971 and delivered mail there for 28 years. If Cooper landed in Portland or Vancouver area, there was NO snow or frigid conditions on the ground. You can check the weather reports or take it from my own personal knowledge ! Nov 24, 1971 was as close as you could ever get to being a typical day in Portland. Check it yourself ! There were no heavy rains or high winds !
Now let’s deal with another Known fact. He did carry onboard a bag which wasn’t there after Cooper bailed. So it’s one of the common sense questions to ask is why On God’s earth would he carry a bag onboard if his plan was to hijack an airplane and jump into a dark and damp night ? Although There’s no proof that there was anything useful in that bag BUT it’s fair to ask “ Why did he bring along this bag ?” That’s been one of my big questions and so it’s prudent to think about Why ! Many crimes are solved by dealing with motives, small details that aren’t evidence but it’s interesting nonetheless! We do know that he came up with a knife to cut up the parachute ropes right ? So nobody saw him with a knife so perhaps it was in the bag. I’m a avid and experienced hunter and I’ve never left with out carrying an altimeter and compass. Of course a knife and flashlight was also in my possession. One night I hiked out of the Colorado wilderness until 3 am. All I’m saying is why did he bring along that bag and what was in it. If It was me I’d have a knife,  compass, altimeter, flashlight, wool socks and perhaps a pair of lightweight boots. There was no airport security back in 1971 so I’d be packing a weapon also. I believe to ignore the FACT he brought aboard a Bag without asking why just not being thorough!

Kermit is correct in assuming that Cooper had a pocket knife or knife of one kind or another.  Otherwise, he would not have been able to cut the shroud lines on the reserve that was left behind.  There was nothing on the airliner that Cooper could have used to cut those lines.  There was probably cutlery onboard but based on my personal experience in that time frame the knives would probably not cut melted butter.  You didn't "cut" the rubber chicken that came with your meal service, you "sawed" it.

The paper bag that Cooper carried with him has variously been described as being as large as a typical grocery store bag and as small as a paper bag that a take-out hamburger comes with.  And the top was also folded over apparently since no one seems to have gotten a glimpse as to what was inside it.

In my opinion, a cloth helmet and goggles would probably be Cooper's first choice.  The bag was not big enough to contain jump boots or winter clothing.

Tina did get a glimpse of what was in the brief case and she only reported a battery and several sticks of what could have been dynamite, flares, or something else.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2020, 06:54:16 PM by Robert99 »
 

Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5701 on: November 10, 2020, 10:17:05 PM »
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I do not have the evidence but you cannot counter it either. He was back there fiddling about for at least 20 minutes after ordering Tina to the cockpit right?  So who knows what he was doing?  Perhaps putting on thermal underwear?  I do not buy into this 57 below zero crap either.  It might have been the wind chill for a split second or two when he jumped?  But that would be it. It was not even snowing. It was rain.  It was not upstate NY.  He could have had other things under that fake bomb.  Survival gear?
First off, let’s deal with known facts as I lived in Portland in 1971 and delivered mail there for 28 years. If Cooper landed in Portland or Vancouver area, there was NO snow or frigid conditions on the ground. You can check the weather reports or take it from my own personal knowledge ! Nov 24, 1971 was as close as you could ever get to being a typical day in Portland. Check it yourself ! There were no heavy rains or high winds !
Now let’s deal with another Known fact. He did carry onboard a bag which wasn’t there after Cooper bailed. So it’s one of the common sense questions to ask is why On God’s earth would he carry a bag onboard if his plan was to hijack an airplane and jump into a dark and damp night ? Although There’s no proof that there was anything useful in that bag BUT it’s fair to ask “ Why did he bring along this bag ?” That’s been one of my big questions and so it’s prudent to think about Why ! Many crimes are solved by dealing with motives, small details that aren’t evidence but it’s interesting nonetheless! We do know that he came up with a knife to cut up the parachute ropes right ? So nobody saw him with a knife so perhaps it was in the bag. I’m a avid and experienced hunter and I’ve never left with out carrying an altimeter and compass. Of course a knife and flashlight was also in my possession. One night I hiked out of the Colorado wilderness until 3 am. All I’m saying is why did he bring along that bag and what was in it. If It was me I’d have a knife,  compass, altimeter, flashlight, wool socks and perhaps a pair of lightweight boots. There was no airport security back in 1971 so I’d be packing a weapon also. I believe to ignore the FACT he brought aboard a Bag without asking why just not being thorough!
There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. Talking about it doesn’t move the case forward or offer the possibility for new evidence, but if you enjoy speculating on completely unknowable information for little or no reason then go off.
 
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Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5702 on: November 11, 2020, 01:37:41 AM »
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I do not have the evidence but you cannot counter it either. He was back there fiddling about for at least 20 minutes after ordering Tina to the cockpit right?  So who knows what he was doing?  Perhaps putting on thermal underwear?  I do not buy into this 57 below zero crap either.  It might have been the wind chill for a split second or two when he jumped?  But that would be it. It was not even snowing. It was rain.  It was not upstate NY.  He could have had other things under that fake bomb.  Survival gear?
First off, let’s deal with known facts as I lived in Portland in 1971 and delivered mail there for 28 years. If Cooper landed in Portland or Vancouver area, there was NO snow or frigid conditions on the ground. You can check the weather reports or take it from my own personal knowledge ! Nov 24, 1971 was as close as you could ever get to being a typical day in Portland. Check it yourself ! There were no heavy rains or high winds !
Now let’s deal with another Known fact. He did carry onboard a bag which wasn’t there after Cooper bailed. So it’s one of the common sense questions to ask is why On God’s earth would he carry a bag onboard if his plan was to hijack an airplane and jump into a dark and damp night ? Although There’s no proof that there was anything useful in that bag BUT it’s fair to ask “ Why did he bring along this bag ?” That’s been one of my big questions and so it’s prudent to think about Why ! Many crimes are solved by dealing with motives, small details that aren’t evidence but it’s interesting nonetheless! We do know that he came up with a knife to cut up the parachute ropes right ? So nobody saw him with a knife so perhaps it was in the bag. I’m a avid and experienced hunter and I’ve never left with out carrying an altimeter and compass. Of course a knife and flashlight was also in my possession. One night I hiked out of the Colorado wilderness until 3 am. All I’m saying is why did he bring along that bag and what was in it. If It was me I’d have a knife,  compass, altimeter, flashlight, wool socks and perhaps a pair of lightweight boots. There was no airport security back in 1971 so I’d be packing a weapon also. I believe to ignore the FACT he brought aboard a Bag without asking why just not being thorough!
There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. Talking about it doesn’t move the case forward or offer the possibility for new evidence, but if you enjoy speculating on completely unknowable information for little or no reason then go off.

Chaucer,  You need to read the above slower since you apparently are jumping to some conclusions.  And as far as speculating goes, I doubt if you are the right person to give lectures on that subject.
 

Offline DBfan57

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5703 on: November 11, 2020, 03:53:21 AM »
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I do not have the evidence but you cannot counter it either. He was back there fiddling about for at least 20 minutes after ordering Tina to the cockpit right?  So who knows what he was doing?  Perhaps putting on thermal underwear?  I do not buy into this 57 below zero crap either.  It might have been the wind chill for a split second or two when he jumped?  But that would be it. It was not even snowing. It was rain.  It was not upstate NY.  He could have had other things under that fake bomb.  Survival gear?
This the argument from ignorance fallacy. Lack of evidence is not evidence.

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Cooper could have been masturbating in the bathroom. He could have had gummy balls in his brown paper bag. He could have had 7 joints hidden in his briefcase.

Unless there is evidence, it is unknowable
Pretty ridiculous answer IMO.  I highly doubt he was jerking off with what he was undertaking
 

Offline DBfan57

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5704 on: November 11, 2020, 03:57:13 AM »
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I do not have the evidence but you cannot counter it either. He was back there fiddling about for at least 20 minutes after ordering Tina to the cockpit right?  So who knows what he was doing?  Perhaps putting on thermal underwear?  I do not buy into this 57 below zero crap either.  It might have been the wind chill for a split second or two when he jumped?  But that would be it. It was not even snowing. It was rain.  It was not upstate NY.  He could have had other things under that fake bomb.  Survival gear?
First off, let’s deal with known facts as I lived in Portland in 1971 and delivered mail there for 28 years. If Cooper landed in Portland or Vancouver area, there was NO snow or frigid conditions on the ground. You can check the weather reports or take it from my own personal knowledge ! Nov 24, 1971 was as close as you could ever get to being a typical day in Portland. Check it yourself ! There were no heavy rains or high winds !
Now let’s deal with another Known fact. He did carry onboard a bag which wasn’t there after Cooper bailed. So it’s one of the common sense questions to ask is why On God’s earth would he carry a bag onboard if his plan was to hijack an airplane and jump into a dark and damp night ? Although There’s no proof that there was anything useful in that bag BUT it’s fair to ask “ Why did he bring along this bag ?” That’s been one of my big questions and so it’s prudent to think about Why ! Many crimes are solved by dealing with motives, small details that aren’t evidence but it’s interesting nonetheless! We do know that he came up with a knife to cut up the parachute ropes right ? So nobody saw him with a knife so perhaps it was in the bag. I’m a avid and experienced hunter and I’ve never left with out carrying an altimeter and compass. Of course a knife and flashlight was also in my possession. One night I hiked out of the Colorado wilderness until 3 am. All I’m saying is why did he bring along that bag and what was in it. If It was me I’d have a knife,  compass, altimeter, flashlight, wool socks and perhaps a pair of lightweight boots. There was no airport security back in 1971 so I’d be packing a weapon also. I believe to ignore the FACT he brought aboard a Bag without asking why just not being thorough!
Now this makes sense.  I am willing to bet anything that he had things he needed in that bag.   Maybe Chaucer will say it contained his knitting supplies?
 

Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5705 on: November 11, 2020, 01:56:43 PM »
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I do not have the evidence but you cannot counter it either. He was back there fiddling about for at least 20 minutes after ordering Tina to the cockpit right?  So who knows what he was doing?  Perhaps putting on thermal underwear?  I do not buy into this 57 below zero crap either.  It might have been the wind chill for a split second or two when he jumped?  But that would be it. It was not even snowing. It was rain.  It was not upstate NY.  He could have had other things under that fake bomb.  Survival gear?
First off, let’s deal with known facts as I lived in Portland in 1971 and delivered mail there for 28 years. If Cooper landed in Portland or Vancouver area, there was NO snow or frigid conditions on the ground. You can check the weather reports or take it from my own personal knowledge ! Nov 24, 1971 was as close as you could ever get to being a typical day in Portland. Check it yourself ! There were no heavy rains or high winds !
Now let’s deal with another Known fact. He did carry onboard a bag which wasn’t there after Cooper bailed. So it’s one of the common sense questions to ask is why On God’s earth would he carry a bag onboard if his plan was to hijack an airplane and jump into a dark and damp night ? Although There’s no proof that there was anything useful in that bag BUT it’s fair to ask “ Why did he bring along this bag ?” That’s been one of my big questions and so it’s prudent to think about Why ! Many crimes are solved by dealing with motives, small details that aren’t evidence but it’s interesting nonetheless! We do know that he came up with a knife to cut up the parachute ropes right ? So nobody saw him with a knife so perhaps it was in the bag. I’m a avid and experienced hunter and I’ve never left with out carrying an altimeter and compass. Of course a knife and flashlight was also in my possession. One night I hiked out of the Colorado wilderness until 3 am. All I’m saying is why did he bring along that bag and what was in it. If It was me I’d have a knife,  compass, altimeter, flashlight, wool socks and perhaps a pair of lightweight boots. There was no airport security back in 1971 so I’d be packing a weapon also. I believe to ignore the FACT he brought aboard a Bag without asking why just not being thorough!
Now this makes sense.  I am willing to bet anything that he had things he needed in that bag.   Maybe Chaucer will say it contained his knitting supplies?

Keep track of the size of that small bag ... doubtful he had a sledge hammer in that bag .... or a Skill saw !  Or a horse ...  or a mule ...  or a ladder ...
 

Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5706 on: November 11, 2020, 03:26:40 PM »
I’ll say this again for those not paying attention:

There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. It could be anything or nothing. Talking about it doesn’t assist in solving the case because it would only be imaginary.

But if anyone wants to engage in that sort of thing:  feel free. I really don’t give a shit.

I also find it endlessly amusing to be accused of “speculation” from a guy who believes this case involves a massive cover-up and a conspiracy involving the FBI.  :rofl:
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5707 on: November 11, 2020, 05:41:52 PM »
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I’ll say this again for those not paying attention:

There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. It could be anything or nothing. Talking about it doesn’t assist in solving the case because it would only be imaginary.

But if anyone wants to engage in that sort of thing:  feel free. I really don’t give a shit.

I also find it endlessly amusing to be accused of “speculation” from a guy who believes this case involves a massive cover-up and a conspiracy involving the FBI.  :rofl:

Chaucer,

I have never claimed to know what was in the paper bag and so far as I know neither has anyone else.  I did suggest that one item that Cooper could find very useful and that could be carried in that small bag would be a cloth helmet and goggles.  If you had any experience with a 200 MPH wind in your face, you would probably agree with that.

Your last comment is answered in the post on DropZone that I referenced.
 

Offline DBfan57

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5708 on: November 11, 2020, 06:07:03 PM »
First Aid kit, Scotch, gun, balloons, whistle, flashlight, maps, thermos of coffee.  Easy! ;D
 

Offline fcastle866

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5709 on: November 11, 2020, 09:05:59 PM »
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I’ll say this again for those not paying attention:

There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. It could be anything or nothing. Talking about it doesn’t assist in solving the case because it would only be imaginary.

But if anyone wants to engage in that sort of thing:  feel free. I really don’t give a shit.

I also find it endlessly amusing to be accused of “speculation” from a guy who believes this case involves a massive cover-up and a conspiracy involving the FBI.  :rofl:

Much of this case involves speculation.  Speculation is what keeps the public interested in it, it feeds conversation, and helps everyone learn.  This is not the forum for "it never happened" or "the pilots were in on it", but discussing what could have been in the bag has been a good topic through the years.  Some of the posters like Georger lean away from speculation (although he did recently talk about nicotine stains on a hand possibly being something else machinery related).  Others welcome the speculation.  When it gets out of control, Shutter is good about shutting it down, no pun intended.  Chaucer, you recently speculated about the air stairs didn't you? 

We seem to have a problem attracting new people to this board.  Let's not run the new guy off.  You are fairly new to the group yourself.  I'd like to think we are all on the same team.  I for one enjoy hearing other's speculation.
 

Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5710 on: November 11, 2020, 11:16:50 PM »
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I’ll say this again for those not paying attention:

There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. It could be anything or nothing. Talking about it doesn’t assist in solving the case because it would only be imaginary.

But if anyone wants to engage in that sort of thing:  feel free. I really don’t give a shit.

I also find it endlessly amusing to be accused of “speculation” from a guy who believes this case involves a massive cover-up and a conspiracy involving the FBI.  :rofl:

Much of this case involves speculation.  Speculation is what keeps the public interested in it, it feeds conversation, and helps everyone learn.  This is not the forum for "it never happened" or "the pilots were in on it", but discussing what could have been in the bag has been a good topic through the years.  Some of the posters like Georger lean away from speculation (although he did recently talk about nicotine stains on a hand possibly being something else machinery related).  Others welcome the speculation.  When it gets out of control, Shutter is good about shutting it down, no pun intended.  Chaucer, you recently speculated about the air stairs didn't you? 

We seem to have a problem attracting new people to this board.  Let's not run the new guy off.  You are fairly new to the group yourself.  I'd like to think we are all on the same team.  I for one enjoy hearing other's speculation.

No,  you have that wrong too.

Georger posted Flyjack's speculations about nicotine hands being occupational disease syndrome.  All I did was post what someone else said.  Please keep track!   
 

Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5711 on: November 12, 2020, 12:21:23 AM »
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Chaucer, you recently speculated about the air stairs didn't you? 
No. I did not.

Also speculation is fine for reasons you mentioned. I just don’t seem the purpose of discussing things that we can never know or things that don’t bring us closer to solving the case. Should we speculating about what kind of car Cooper drive? Should we discuss what his sexual orientation was? If you want to, go ahead.

I just personally don’t see the point.
 

Offline DBfan57

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5712 on: November 12, 2020, 06:27:34 AM »
 :good post:
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I’ll say this again for those not paying attention:

There is absolutely no way to know what was in the bag. It could be anything or nothing. Talking about it doesn’t assist in solving the case because it would only be imaginary.

But if anyone wants to engage in that sort of thing:  feel free. I really don’t give a shit.

I also find it endlessly amusing to be accused of “speculation” from a guy who believes this case involves a massive cover-up and a conspiracy involving the FBI.  :rofl:

Much of this case involves speculation.  Speculation is what keeps the public interested in it, it feeds conversation, and helps everyone learn.  This is not the forum for "it never happened" or "the pilots were in on it", but discussing what could have been in the bag has been a good topic through the years.  Some of the posters like Georger lean away from speculation (although he did recently talk about nicotine stains on a hand possibly being something else machinery related).  Others welcome the speculation.  When it gets out of control, Shutter is good about shutting it down, no pun intended.  Chaucer, you recently speculated about the air stairs didn't you? 

We seem to have a problem attracting new people to this board.  Let's not run the new guy off.  You are fairly new to the group yourself.  I'd like to think we are all on the same team.  I for one enjoy hearing other's speculation.
:good post:   Speculation is all we have in much of this.  And oh, those damn Raleigh cigarettes.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5713 on: November 12, 2020, 10:07:12 AM »
Speculation can often confuse and weaken things. you can't really learn from speculation. that's like being told you think 2 + 2 = 5.

Yes, lots of speculation is in this case. if you use it you need to try and back it up. we have a vault loaded with a lot of questions that can be answered. it takes time to try and get up to speed with others since so much is to be learned weeding out a lot of false claims or speculation some read about the case. nothing wrong with discussing what might be in the mystery bag Cooper had but what will it achieve in solving the case. was any of the copycats caught with first aid kits and survival gear? not a lot of criminals think that far ahead.

If he had goggles and gloves where do we go from there. did that make his jump successful? so many things can go wrong.

I've been at this for years and I'm still not sold he made it. it's a strong possibility he did but just can't call it.

People think I'm foolish to try a test surrounding the placard. I want to see how the torn placard reacts to one that isn't damaged. others need different data from the test. this is being kept off the board for now. I've been grounded for two weeks and currently underwater. we got over 12 inches of rain dropped in a very short period. as of today a lot of the water has disappeared. the winds are a factor as well.
 

Offline DBfan57

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5714 on: November 12, 2020, 11:35:33 AM »
To me the most aggravating part of this case is all of the jerks that have tried to confess to being DB Cooper.  Obviously all but one are lying and most likely they are all lying. My belief is that he made it based on the fact nothing was found.  No body, no clothes or bomb or chutes.  Something would have been found.  He got out.  I would bet on it if I could prove it.