Thank you Robert99 for describing your experiences in a wind tunnel.

I saw a movie of a bank robbery once. If necessary, I can describe how to rob a bank, if you're curious.

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Thank you Robert99 for describing your experiences in a wind tunnel.

I saw a movie of a bank robbery once. If necessary, I can describe how to rob a bank, if you're curious.

My memory must be getting bad, I don't remember describing my experiences in a wind tunnel.  I'll leave the bank robbing business to you.

okay.
I guess next we'll debate why a flag flaps in the wind

I thought you loved Bernoulli?

Shouldn't you start opinionating on what it means when a dynamic system changes state with just 220 lbs (or so) of force in one direction. The wind forces we're talking about are over 220 lbs. The gravity forces are over 220 lbs (the weight of the airstair)

and then guessing about other sources or changes of force of similar magnitude could exist or stop being applied?

I mean I'm not saying something complicated.

I just think it's obvious the analysis of airstair behavior in turbulent winds from differing directions has been overly simplified.

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Thank you Robert99 for describing your experiences in a wind tunnel.

I saw a movie of a bank robbery once. If necessary, I can describe how to rob a bank, if you're curious.

My memory must be getting bad, I don't remember describing my experiences in a wind tunnel.  I'll leave the bank robbing business to you.

okay.
I guess next we'll debate why a flag flaps in the wind

I thought you loved Bernoulli?

Shouldn't you start opinionating on what it means when a dynamic system changes state with just 220 lbs (or so) of force in one direction. The wind forces we're talking about are over 220 lbs. The gravity forces are over 220 lbs (the weight of the airstair)

and then guessing about other sources or changes of force of similar magnitude could exist or stop being applied?

I mean I'm not saying something complicated.

I just think it's obvious the analysis of airstair behavior in turbulent winds from differing directions has been overly simplified.

Snowmman, you need to do some research on aerodynamics.  Since we have a 225 MPH free stream velocity, just where are the significant winds from different directions going to come from? 

According to George Harrison's notes, at 8:18 PM the flight crew reported over the ARINC radio link that they were 28 DME miles (which are nautical miles) south of the Portland VORTAC (which is now known as the Battleground VORTAC).  The same information was transmitted over the ARINC teletype network at 8:22 PM.

This supports the jump time as being 8:11 to 8:12 PM.

How?

Quote

According to George Harrison's notes, at 8:18 PM the flight crew reported over the ARINC radio link that they were 28 DME miles (which are nautical miles) south of the Portland VORTAC (which is now known as the Battleground VORTAC).  The same information was transmitted over the ARINC teletype network at 8:22 PM.

This supports the jump time as being 8:11 to 8:12 PM.

How?

First, FlyJack has today posted documentation on DropZone that the people directly involved in the flight agreed that the best estimate of the jump time was 8:11 PM.  I recommend that you read his post.

Chaucer, there is enough information on this site for you to make your own calculations as to how this supports the 8:11 PM jump time.  If the calculations are too much for you, then here is a  gross way to estimate the matter.

Proceed as follows.  Take the GPS coordinates for the DME location mentioned above and substract them from the GPS coordinates for the SEATAC airport.  This gives you a distance.  Substract the 7:26 PM takeoff time from SEATAC from the 8:18 PM time at the DME location and this gives you a time.  Divide the distance by the time and that gives you an average speed between those two points.

Then work backward from the DME location along the direct line between the two points to see the approximate location of the airliner at various times.

If all else fails, download the appropriate manuals from the FAA's web page and do some studying. 

All of the current "best info" doesn't provide a story about how the money arrived at Tena Bar in the condition it was found.

The most likely reason: the current best info has an error somewhere.

It's reminicent of the FBI/Carr being stuck on calling Cooper a whuffo. And claiming the evidence pointed to him being a whuffo. (it doesn't)

Any good investigation should always allow for some bit of "evidence" to be wrongly interpreted. Because that happens. It's not obvious why until after things are solved.

Arguably, it's unlikely multiple bits of evidence are wrongly interpreted. But highly likely one is.

Its highly unlikely " the money arrived at Tena Bar in the condition it was found." The condition of the money is a consequence of natural processes working, in-situ.   

well, you can break it down
1) the condition the money was in when handed to Cooper
2) The money didn't change state while Cooper had it..i.e. he didn't burn it or something.
3) The money was somewhere for a period of time. It was likely outdoors or under water. So it changed state
4) The money was then on Tena Bar. It then had another change of state.

So the final state, is basically dependent on 3 and 4.
it's unclear how that breaks down.

it's unlikely Cooper jumped and left the money on tena bar that night, so that 3 and 4 would be combined.

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Quote

According to George Harrison's notes, at 8:18 PM the flight crew reported over the ARINC radio link that they were 28 DME miles (which are nautical miles) south of the Portland VORTAC (which is now known as the Battleground VORTAC).  The same information was transmitted over the ARINC teletype network at 8:22 PM.

This supports the jump time as being 8:11 to 8:12 PM.

How?

First, FlyJack has today posted documentation on DropZone that the people directly involved in the flight agreed that the best estimate of the jump time was 8:11 PM.  I recommend that you read his post.

Chaucer, there is enough information on this site for you to make your own calculations as to how this supports the 8:11 PM jump time.  If the calculations are too much for you, then here is a  gross way to estimate the matter.

Proceed as follows.  Take the GPS coordinates for the DME location mentioned above and substract them from the GPS coordinates for the SEATAC airport.  This gives you a distance.  Substract the 7:26 PM takeoff time from SEATAC from the 8:18 PM time at the DME location and this gives you a time.  Divide the distance by the time and that gives you an average speed between those two points.

Then work backward from the DME location along the direct line between the two points to see the approximate location of the airliner at various times.

If all else fails, download the appropriate manuals from the FAA's web page and do some studying.

You have still failed to explain how the DME information suggests an 8:11 jump. All the DME information did was indicate a location of 305 at a particular point in time. To my knowledge, it does nothing to indicate any time related to Cooper's jump.

If that's not accurate, please educate me.

Chaucer, have you done what I recommend above?  If you don't understand what I was saying above, please let me know and give me some idea about your level of understanding related to mathematics, navigation, etc., so that I can speak to your level.