Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

Author Topic: Tena Bar Money Find  (Read 1848006 times)

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2085 on: June 28, 2016, 10:59:52 PM »
I'll put the link at the bottom of our dredge section on our website...most of the things they spoke of were metal, and they believed some of the money could get through.

I think it's on Tom's sight where they stated a wiper bar was on the dredge pipe, but that only blocks large objects, mainly rocks.

The emails are also on that page...


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« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 11:02:04 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline andrade1812

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2086 on: June 30, 2016, 12:45:50 AM »
I have no idea how the dredge theory doesn't win out over the other ideas. Obviously, I'll read R99's theory with an open mind, but the dredge is really the only thing that explains the fragments we see get excavated in the video.

And have we forgotten about Georger's element X? wasn't that supposed to be from the river bed where the dredge spoils originated?
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2087 on: June 30, 2016, 01:01:27 AM »
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I have no idea how the dredge theory doesn't win out over the other ideas. Obviously, I'll read R99's theory with an open mind, but the dredge is really the only thing that explains the fragments we see get excavated in the video.

And have we forgotten about Georger's element X? wasn't that supposed to be from the river bed where the dredge spoils originated?

I havent forgotten.  :))  The devil is in the details - thanks for bringing it up!  :))

BTW: we have acquired a profile of the strata at Tena Bar - it is unsigned but we believe it dates to the excavation in '80 and was drawn either by Palmer himself or one of his students/co workers at Portland State. I need to get permission to use this graphic or permission to post a facsimile of it. Give me a few days. Some of you may not think this is important but in a matter of this kind I dont believe a graphic like this should be passed up, so give me a few days ... and wish me luck with this. If the graphic is accurate it settles one question of how the strata were layed out in Palmer's trench, from the water line up to Ingram's find and slightly above that point. In any event give me a fews days. 
« Last Edit: June 30, 2016, 01:12:47 AM by georger »
 

Offline nmiwrecks

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2088 on: June 30, 2016, 12:11:46 PM »
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BTW: we have acquired a profile of the strata at Tena Bar - it is unsigned but we believe it dates to the excavation in '80 and was drawn either by Palmer himself or one of his students/co workers at Portland State. I need to get permission to use this graphic or permission to post a facsimile of it. Give me a few days. Some of you may not think this is important but in a matter of this kind I dont believe a graphic like this should be passed up, so give me a few days ... 

This profile will be another important piece to this puzzle.  The makeup of Tena Bar river bank is a difficult thing to grasp.  It's not like a flat field with even stable layers.  We are dealing with an area of changing elevation,  where soil is eroded by water action of rain and the river, and soil is deposited by flooding and man.  And let's not forget the earth moving machinery which has reworked the area from time to time.  It's very confusing.

So good luck, and let us know what you find!
"If you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always got." - Henry Ford
 

Offline nmiwrecks

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2089 on: June 30, 2016, 12:17:00 PM »
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I have no idea how the dredge theory doesn't win out over the other ideas. Obviously, I'll read R99's theory with an open mind, but the dredge is really the only thing that explains the fragments we see get excavated in the video.

And have we forgotten about Georger's element X? wasn't that supposed to be from the river bed where the dredge spoils originated?

And the coincidence that the money was found downstream of where the 727 crossed the Columbia is to big to ignore.  The pilots comment of being near the Portland suburbs when Cooper jumped is pretty telling also.  So if the money landed in the middle of the Columbia, where did Cooper land?  Our "new" living suspect has got some "splaining" to do.   O0    O0    O0
« Last Edit: June 30, 2016, 12:20:35 PM by nmiwrecks »
"If you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always got." - Henry Ford
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2090 on: June 30, 2016, 02:22:55 PM »
...about his splashin' (?)...
« Last Edit: June 30, 2016, 02:23:07 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

Offline 377

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2091 on: June 30, 2016, 08:02:40 PM »
I sure hope he didn't splash.

You pull it off. You actually get the money, jump, get a good open canopy and then land in the frigging Columbia River? Arrrrrrgh. Can you imagine the misery? It would just be the worst.

It would be better to go in as a no pull, by far.

377
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2092 on: July 01, 2016, 03:41:17 PM »
The strata Dr. Palmer found at Tina Bar are as follows: a profile of his strata is attached.

'Fig 3a.   Sediment replenishment profile at the Tena Bar Recreational area near Portland, 1980. 

Dr. Palmer’s trench dug near the money find revealed approx four layers.

(a) upper active sand layer. 6-8 inches six inches of reworked sand where all of the fragments and bundles of the recovered money was found, according to Palmer.This sand contained soda pop cans and other debris of a recent origin, not severely damaged or rusted. The upper six inches to eight inches of reworked beach sand is the active layer which is currently being worked on by natural forces and water from the Columbia River. The money and fragments were distributed in the upper surface layer only, and none were found in the post dredging layer. With this height on the beach it suggests the money was deposited more than four years after the dredging work at Tena Bar in 1974. The money did not work its way up through the post dredging sand to the upper layer, according to Dr. Palmer.

(b) post dredging sand layer. The post dredging sand contained older soda pop cans, rusted nails and spikes, and other rusted and more deteriorated artifacts vs. artifacts found in the upper active layer. This post dredging sand is cross bedded course and medium sand  as a result of the river and river waves have worked repeatedly on this layer since 1974.

(c) clay lump (dredge) sand layer. The clay lump dredging layer was a mixture of course sand and fragments of organic clay, ranging from one to five inches in size. This layer ranged in depth from two feet where the money was found, to approximately four feet deep 25 yards from the money site which is coincidently closer to the north-most 1974 dredging spoil dump sites.

(d) older sand layer. Older sands were found below the 1974 clay lump (dredge) layer, and were light in color and uniform in texture, with evidence of cross bedding.

Note* Dr. Palmer stresses that Cooper money, as far as he is concerned, was found only in the upper layer of sand, and none was found below that level in the post-dredging layer, or deeper. The recently found KATU video challenges that interpretation/claim.

Moreover, Dr. Palmer said that the upper active layer of sand on beach is "sterile" which in his opinion accounted for why any money had survived at all in Nature since 1971, which also supported the idea that the money was a recent arrival on Tina Bar, having arrived probably within the last year.

-see facsimile of Palmer strata chart attached -   
« Last Edit: July 01, 2016, 06:37:32 PM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2093 on: July 01, 2016, 04:05:43 PM »
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The strata Dr. Palmer found at Tina Bar are as follows: a profile of his strata is attached.

'Fig 3a.   Sediment replenishment profile at the Tena Bar Recreational area near Portland, 1980. 

Dr. Palmer’s trench dug near the money find revealed approx four layers.

(a) upper active sand layer. 6-8 inches six inches of reworked sand where all of the fragments and bundles of the recovered money was found, according to Palmer.This sand contained soda pop cans and other debris of a recent origin, not severely damaged or rusted. The upper six inches to eight inches of reworked beach sand is the active layer which is currently being worked on by natural forces and water from the Columbia River. The money and fragments were distributed in the upper surface layer only, and none were found in the post dredging layer. With this height on the beach it suggests the money was deposited more than four years after the dredging work at Tena Bar in 1974. The money did not work its way up through the post dredging sand to the upper layer, according to Dr. Palmer.

(b) post dredging sand layer. The post dredging sand contained older soda pop cans, rusted nails and spikes, and other rusted and more deteriorated artifacts vs. artifacts found in the upper active layer. This post dredging sand is cross bedded course and medium sand  as a result of the river and river waves have worked repeatedly on this layer since 1974.

(c) clay lump (dredge) sand layer. The clay lump dredging layer was a mixture of course sand and fragments of organic clay, ranging from one to five inches in size. This layer ranged in depth from two feet where the money was found, to approximately four feet deep 25 yards from the money site which is coincidently closer to the north-most 1974 dredging spoil dump sites.

(d) older sand layer. Older sands were found below the 1974 clay lump (dredge) layer, and were light in color and uniform in texture, with evidence of cross bedding.

Note* Dr. Palmer stresses that Cooper money, as far as he is concerned, was found only in the upper layer of sand, and none was found below that level in the post-dredging layer, or deeper. The recently found KATU video may challenge that interpretation.

Moreover, Dr. Palmer said that the upper active layer of sand on beach is "sterile" which in his opinion accounted for why any money had survived at all in Nature since 1971, which also supported the idea that the money was a recent arrival on Tina Bar, having arrived probably within the last year.

-see facsimile of Palmer strata chart attached -   

Excellent. Thank you.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2094 on: July 01, 2016, 06:55:56 PM »
For unknown reasons the new video of the money find has been removed from You Tube. I've contacted Carl to try and get some sort of reason for the take down..I just emailed him, so I am waiting for his reply... C:-)
« Last Edit: July 01, 2016, 06:56:13 PM by Shutter »
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2095 on: July 01, 2016, 11:27:52 PM »
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For unknown reasons the new video of the money find has been removed from You Tube. I've contacted Carl to try and get some sort of reason for the take down..I just emailed him, so I am waiting for his reply... C:-)

Sad.  :-\
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2096 on: July 01, 2016, 11:31:00 PM »
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For unknown reasons the new video of the money find has been removed from You Tube. I've contacted Carl to try and get some sort of reason for the take down..I just emailed him, so I am waiting for his reply... C:-)

Sad.  :-\

It is, he removed the one about the Ariel store as well? hopefully, he will respond to my email... :'(
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2097 on: July 02, 2016, 03:51:12 AM »
A disappointment, for sure, but I suspect that sprinkling a bit o' cash around might free things up a bit. Cooper World Calling Hollywood. Any producers out there wanna buy up film rights to a DB Cooper hotsy-totsy film clip???
 

Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2098 on: July 02, 2016, 11:39:42 AM »
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A disappointment, for sure, but I suspect that sprinkling a bit o' cash around might free things up a bit. Cooper World Calling Hollywood. Any producers out there wanna buy up film rights to a DB Cooper hotsy-totsy film clip???

Bruce,

Don't be greedy. :(  If this project helps to advance the resolution of the Cooper hijacking, that alone will make our efforts worthwhile.

So don't mention $$$$$ again here.  Anyway, you should already be cleaning up with your book on Cooper.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2016, 11:40:33 AM by Robert99 »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #2099 on: July 02, 2016, 11:53:29 AM »
If I don't get a response from Carl, I will have no other option but to contact KATU and see if they have the same footage archived. this was valuable information. it deserves to be seen, and is considered evidence IMO. I can still view it, but I refuse
to post it until all matters are resolved.

I consider this video a giant step forward with the money find. it opened doors, and closed them at the same time.

Shutter
« Last Edit: July 02, 2016, 11:54:01 AM by Shutter »