Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (11.1%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (7.4%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.7%)
50% Cooper lived
11 (20.4%)
75% Cooper lived
12 (22.2%)
100 Cooper lived
19 (35.2%)

Total Members Voted: 49

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 573255 times)

Offline EU

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6765 on: July 27, 2021, 06:40:43 PM »
As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

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Offline Robert99

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6766 on: July 27, 2021, 06:55:25 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

The advance information for the EU show on August 4th says it is based on new information which is listed as a "death bed confession".  Is this program putting Duane Weber back in the mix?  Is Jo Weber participating in the program?  If so, was she interviewed in the facility where she reportedly resides at the present time.

It will be a crime against nature if this program just adds another layer to all the misinformation about the Cooper hijacking.
 

Offline EU

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6767 on: July 27, 2021, 07:48:52 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

The advance information for the EU show on August 4th says it is based on new information which is listed as a "death bed confession".  Is this program putting Duane Weber back in the mix?  Is Jo Weber participating in the program?  If so, was she interviewed in the facility where she reportedly resides at the present time.

It will be a crime against nature if this program just adds another layer to all the misinformation about the Cooper hijacking.
We're not talking Duane Weber.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

RFK
 

Offline dudeman17

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6768 on: July 27, 2021, 09:27:02 PM »
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I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing...  The things described to me by my source make sense.


A fair amount of my latest input is based on your statement that Cossey regularly used the DBC rig as an instructor. At first read that made no sense to me because it is not a normally 'jumpable' rig. On further thought, if Cossey normally used gutter gear, that gear is bigger, heavier, and cumbersome. So if he was just putting out static line students and not intending to jump, then perhaps it does make sense. Can your source confirm that aspect? Is your source a jumper? From that era?

I never saw or heard of such a practice, but by the time I came along there were no instructors still using gutter gear. I'm curious if 377 ever saw or heard of it.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6769 on: July 28, 2021, 02:55:00 AM »
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The advance information for the EU show on August 4th says it is based on new information which is listed as a "death bed confession".  Is this program putting Duane Weber back in the mix?  Is Jo Weber participating in the program?  If so, was she interviewed in the facility where she reportedly resides at the present time.

It will be a crime against nature if this program just adds another layer to all the misinformation about the Cooper hijacking.
We're not talking Duane Weber.

I have no idea who the new suspect is and I'm in the show! Hopefully. The promo was the first time I had heard about this dimension of the broadcast.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6770 on: July 28, 2021, 02:58:21 AM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.
 

Offline EU

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6771 on: July 28, 2021, 08:32:26 AM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

RFK
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6772 on: July 28, 2021, 01:23:20 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.

Interesting gambit you make. As of there is something special about your 'theories' people should pay attention to. The other folks are focusing on the chute - the real parachute! The chute Cooper used! Its location will determine the facts of the case vs. all of your half-baked forced assumptions which arent supported by anything real ....

Its science vs. ballyhoo. Data vs Performance art and hair brain ideas !
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 02:12:09 PM by georger »
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6773 on: July 28, 2021, 01:45:18 PM »
An orig. statement by Cossey on the chute. If Cossey's statement is not true then . . .  C:-)

The chute (remnant?) found near a dam in the Lewis near Ariel ? Not too far from Heisson Store ?  An agent was sent to examine that 'remnant' that a lady was holding, and he judged that material not to be part of a parachute? There's a doc or two about this ... ? 

I am NOT going to spend any time looking for the docs. Its just too time consuming.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 02:10:02 PM by georger »
 

Online Chaucer

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6774 on: July 28, 2021, 02:23:08 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6775 on: July 28, 2021, 02:31:01 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.

Interesting gambit you make. As of there is something special about your 'theories' people should pay attention to. The other folks are focusing on the chute - the real parachute! The chute Cooper used! Its location will determine the facts of the case vs. all of your half-baked forced assumptions which arent supported by anything real ....

Its science vs. ballyhoo. Data vs Performance art and hair brain ideas !

Georger, science is people digging up the money at Tena Bar.  Ballyhoo is Cossey's confusion about the parachutes.
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6776 on: July 28, 2021, 02:36:32 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My stance is you cant assume the TBar find by itself is key.

Your premise is an assumption and probably false:  'Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.'
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 02:40:04 PM by georger »
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6777 on: July 28, 2021, 02:37:09 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My dear Chaucer, if the money found at Tena Bar actually came downstream from somewhere around the Portland International Airport area, it would have ended up on the Oregon side of the river.  Water runs down hill which is something you should have learned in English 101. 
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6778 on: July 28, 2021, 02:37:37 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.

Interesting gambit you make. As of there is something special about your 'theories' people should pay attention to. The other folks are focusing on the chute - the real parachute! The chute Cooper used! Its location will determine the facts of the case vs. all of your half-baked forced assumptions which arent supported by anything real ....

Its science vs. ballyhoo. Data vs Performance art and hair brain ideas !

Georger, science is people digging up the money at Tena Bar.  Ballyhoo is Cossey's confusion about the parachutes.

Stop lecturing your inferiors!    :rofl:
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #6779 on: July 28, 2021, 02:38:38 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My dear Chaucer, if the money found at Tena Bar actually came downstream from somewhere around the Portland International Airport area, it would have ended up on the Oregon side of the river.  Water runs down hill which is something you should have learned in English 101.

Again, stop lecturing your inferiors you pompous . . . mind control wont work here! Worst of all it always sidetracks everyone thinking! If thats what you are trying to do - ytou always accomplish that and send people back to watching eagles or playing with something else. YOU ARENOT THE BOSS OF US!

Lets just let r99 BE IN CHARGE. fUCK THIS SHIT.   
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 02:42:33 PM by georger »