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So Smith you are the sole source on dna being collected from the tie clasp vs tie itself. You say your source was a phone call from Ckret. This is all very strange since Ckret never shared this with the rest of the world.

It appears that I am just a Super-Dooper Investigative Reporter! Wow. I've been sitting on a SCOOP for seven years and didn't know it!

Thanks, Georger, for helping me realize how smart I truly am...

Of course you are the only source for the FBI sample being taken from the tie clasp. Everywhere else Ckret said the sample comes from the tie - he never mentioned it coming from the clasp. The source being touch dna is also new. If you and Larry are correct, assuming you copied his remarks accurately, then that makes Blevins' 'eipthelial' cells he got from Porteous and the FBI email, wrong.

It probably can't be both touch dna and epithelial cells.

KIRO vs KING

Yup. Confusion.

Spoke at length with "Linda" at KING. She's been around a while - 1992-something. Knows the case. Knows her archives, too. Doesn't remember any broadcast about Cooper and cigarette butts. Remembers Chris Ingalls's initial broadcast in 2003 about DNA. Source of DNA not disclosed, however.

But a new FBI agent was identified. SA Charles Mindigo. He was quoted at length. He was not a PIO, apparently. Never heard of him before.

I also spoke with Sharon at KING. Sharon was not as golden-an-oldie as Linda, but she was very diligent. Spoke with her colleagues at length. Their archives are not as extensive as KING. KIRO only went to 2004 with extra searching. Normal search only goes to 2008. They found nothing on cigarette butts and DB Cooper. Sharon knows the case fairly well, (for a millennial). Remembers Marla!

I've discussed this broadcast business with Ron and Pat at length over the years. They are adamant about seeing a cigarette butt broadcast in 2001-2002.

I also spoke with these people and Ingalls returned my call - last Friday. Extensive searches were done on Friday. Chris mailed me all relevant transcripts done at KING on Cooper dna after Chris interviewed  SA Charles Mindigo. KING-5 can't find any program like you describe the Forman's report seeing, and so far, no program done by Mr. Bounds on that topic.

The issue of course is the sources you cite and the credibility of those sources and the info you present.

Maybe JT or Jo Weber or Blevins saw the program and can confirm?

 
   

DNA on clasp

I just received an email from Chris Ingalls at KING 5 TV. He confirms that he was told by Larry Carr in 2007 that a DNA sample was retrieved from the tie and clasp, as Carr reported to me. This seems to contradict Georger, and more importantly puts G in a harsh light because Georger has just posted saying that he has had recent correspondence with Mr. Ingalls, but fails to mention the clasp.

The following is from Chris Ingalls:

"...The bottom line is that we have not reported that saliva was taken from the cigarette butts.
 
In 2003, I reported that a weak sample of DNA was retrieved from Cooper and it was now considered somewhat usable for ruling out a suspect.
 
In 2007, I reported that Agent Carr said that this DNA came from the tie clasp and tie clip recovered on the plane. (emphasis added, BAS.)

I don’t know that I ever reported it – but I have been told by at least a couple of FBI agents that the cigarette butts were lost at some point.
 
Chris Ingalls
News Reporter"

DNA on clasp

I just received an email from Chris Ingalls at KING 5 TV. He confirms that he was told by Larry Carr in 2007 that a DNA sample was retrieved from the tie and clasp, as Carr reported to me. This seems to contradict Georger, and more importantly puts G in a harsh light because Georger has just posted saying that he has had recent correspondence with Mr. Ingalls, but fails to mention the clasp.

The following is from Chris Ingalls:

"...The bottom line is that we have not reported that saliva was taken from the cigarette butts.
 
In 2003, I reported that a weak sample of DNA was retrieved from Cooper and it was now considered somewhat usable for ruling out a suspect.
 
In 2007, I reported that Agent Carr said that this DNA came from the tie clasp and tie clip recovered on the plane. (emphasis added, BAS.)

I don’t know that I ever reported it – but I have been told by at least a couple of FBI agents that the cigarette butts were lost at some point.
 
Chris Ingalls
News Reporter"

Nothing I have said puts me in a harsh light. That's absurd, Mr. Drama Queen Smith. Show any public statement Carr made where he says the dna came off the clasp? That is all I have been saying. It's odd Carr would give out one story publicly then turn around and give out another story to you and King-5. Why didn't Carr or you post this information to Dropzone? Shutter says he saw it only on your website at Mountain News.

Likewise, I have the transcripts Chris Ingalls sent me. Neither transcript mentions tie clasp. The 2007 transcript Ingalls did with Carr says only:   FOR THE FIRST TIME -- THE F-B-I CONFIRMS THAT HAS BEEN ABLE TO DEVELOP A D-N-A SAMPLE FROM EVIDENCE COLLECTED FROM THE TIE IN 2001. The 2003 Ingalls transcript says nothing.
So I guess Ingalls has some other story he failed to mention to me and failed to copy to me, he is now citing to you?

Has it occurred to you Carr might be wrong? 


 





 

Listen up guys!

You need to have a civil disagreement, or nothing!

Bruce, please don't stoop to using Blevin's tactics by posting people's names who don't wish to have them made public. (regardless to it being in a book). I seen an edit made 14 minutes after the original post was made. I don't know if the full name was there or not. this occurred after I shut down for the evening.

I received a complaint/threat that I don't appreciate what so ever! resolve your differences in a civil manner.

 

Listen up guys!

You need to have a civil disagreement, or nothing!

Bruce, please don't stoop to using Blevin's tactics by posting people's names who don't wish to have them made public. (regardless to it being in a book). I seen an edit made 14 minutes after the original post was made. I don't know if the full name was there or not. this occurred after I shut down for the evening.

I received a complaint/threat that I don't appreciate what so ever! resolve your differences in a civil manner.

Let's summarise: The claim that the Cooper cigarette butts were processed for dna, remains unproven.  The claim that the tie clasp provided a positive result, vs. the tie itself, seems to be corroborated by Chris Ingalls at KING-5 in private conversation he had with Larry Carr? But so far, there is no instance of Carr saying this publicy, for example at Dropzone. It would be interesting to know where Tom Kaye stands in this matter given his conversations with Carr.

It's worth noting that if the FBI were to send some knowledgeable person to this website to answer questions, perhaps none of this speculation-discussion would be necessary.

Why does any of this matter? It matters because we would like to know who Cooper was. Cooper's personal genetic info might go some distance to identifying who Cooper was, and was-not. For example, Flo said Cooper looked Latin to her; the bulk of suspects suggested by the public on forums so far have all been non-Latin. Another witness said he had the impression the FBI was concentrating on suspects from the Eugene Oregon area. And we know almost nothing about how any dna profile the FBI has influenced their search for DB Cooper except that the FBI says their profile can exclude people and people including Christiansen, Weber, Peterson, etal have all been excluded on genetic basis alone.

In addition, we know literally nothing about the FBI's pursuit of genetic data in the Cooper case. We hear terms like 'partial profile', 'multiple tests', 'epithelial cells', 'touch dna off the clip', 'collected dna from ... in 2000/2001', 'can rule people out but not people in', et cetera ... but we have no official history of the FBI's actual pursuit of genetic evidence in the Cooper case, a pursuit which began later in the case because this science was not available in the 1970s when the hijacking happened.

I think these are questions we all would like answers to.         


 

Bruce wrote: As for ridicule, well, it's just been another day in the office so to speak...

Worn soles and thick skins.  Long live feet on the street investigative reporters.

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What would the partial CODIS profile the FBI says it has, tell us about Cooper's physical traits?