Author Topic: Flight Path And Related Issues  (Read 170848 times)

Offline georger

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2820 on: September 10, 2019, 03:46:19 PM »
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If you take at look at the file below you will see these statements were written by the agents and not the witnesses. it's obviously the agent was who got the time wrong as well as the name. it's possible they recorded the statements and transferred them to documents or since Campbell appears to have interviewed them used his notes....

I am sure there is a history behind this SNAFU. Different forms of the same info being typed up by different offices and different people .... bureaucratic confusion.   

Keep in mind at the time this is all happening these people (305 NWA crew) are all new to the agents etc. Pretty easy to get these people and their titles confused. 
« Last Edit: September 10, 2019, 03:51:58 PM by georger »
 
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Offline Robert99

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2821 on: September 10, 2019, 04:03:22 PM »
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I don't believe there is anymore to that document. when I post them they are associated with the current discussion and only show details surrounding that subject.

Yes, the Campbell files are the statements taken the evening of the hijacking. I made my files public long before GG made his public. mine are redacted and his are not. Anderson is not in either of the files. I have six separate files in the vault. those are the one's that were sent to me by Reickenbach or how ever his name was spelled. he was part of a group of four that posted under the same username. he grew tired of Blevins and left his site and gave me the files and vanished...

I got my files from Gray. They are un-redacted. Anderson is named. Intro starts -

"11-24 Harold Anderson :
Harold E Anderson, was interviewed at the Reno Airport, Reno Nevada, late on the evening of November 24, 1971. He identified himself as the Third Officer & Flight Engineer on Northwest Airlines Flight #305. 
Anderson advised that according to some notes he made, it was at 2759 Zulu time or 3:59 pm Pacific Standard Time, that he received an emergency signal from hostess Mucklow on the interphone with a series of bells signalling they had trouble onboard. This is a pre-arranged signal for such emergencies and he made a notation in his book of the time of notification. "

Georger, if you typed that in correctly, then there is a problem with the original document.

First, Zulu time (which is Greenwich Mean Time) only goes from 0000 to 2400 Zulu.  There is no such time as 2759 Zulu.

Second, I believe the correct time for the start of the hijacking was 2:58 PM PST on November 24, 1971.  In Zulu time, that is 0058 Zulu on November 25, 1971.  Zulu time is 8 hours ahead of PST.

Has nothing to do with me or my typing ... or anyone's typing here.

Georger, are you saying that you did not type in the quotation?  Regardless of how the quotation got into your post, it is wrong.

Anderson was acting as flight engineer on the hijacked aircraft but he was also a NWA pilot.  That is what those three stripes on his uniform sleeves mean.  And I believe that he eventually retired from NWA as a Captain on international flights and flying a 747.

And I am sure that Anderson knew how to tell time and was probably using it in the flight engineer's log he was keeping that day.  And I'll bet that NWA typists were also conversant in the Zulu time system.

So your quotation, wherever it came from, is suspect.

It comes from FBI 302's! There are two sources for these 302's - a guy named Richenbach whoever he is and Geoff Gray.

I am assuming the agent got it wrong. Or two versions of the same notes were typed up maybe at two different offices. Its impossible to know. The info is the same but under two names; Rat vs Anderson.

The rest of the story is these docs do not stand alone but are backed up by other testimony so these two conflicting docs could be thrown out and the same info is still in play. No way to deny that. That is why multiple interviews are always a good thing.

Dont jump to conclusions just because you have a bias to sell.

Georger,

Regardless of how many sources you have for that document, the information is completely wrong.  Only people who have to resort to such false nonsense to support their wild-eyed ideas would have a use for it. 
 

Offline georger

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2822 on: September 10, 2019, 11:24:37 PM »
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I don't believe there is anymore to that document. when I post them they are associated with the current discussion and only show details surrounding that subject.

Yes, the Campbell files are the statements taken the evening of the hijacking. I made my files public long before GG made his public. mine are redacted and his are not. Anderson is not in either of the files. I have six separate files in the vault. those are the one's that were sent to me by Reickenbach or how ever his name was spelled. he was part of a group of four that posted under the same username. he grew tired of Blevins and left his site and gave me the files and vanished...

I got my files from Gray. They are un-redacted. Anderson is named. Intro starts -

"11-24 Harold Anderson :
Harold E Anderson, was interviewed at the Reno Airport, Reno Nevada, late on the evening of November 24, 1971. He identified himself as the Third Officer & Flight Engineer on Northwest Airlines Flight #305. 
Anderson advised that according to some notes he made, it was at 2759 Zulu time or 3:59 pm Pacific Standard Time, that he received an emergency signal from hostess Mucklow on the interphone with a series of bells signalling they had trouble onboard. This is a pre-arranged signal for such emergencies and he made a notation in his book of the time of notification. "

Georger, if you typed that in correctly, then there is a problem with the original document.

First, Zulu time (which is Greenwich Mean Time) only goes from 0000 to 2400 Zulu.  There is no such time as 2759 Zulu.

Second, I believe the correct time for the start of the hijacking was 2:58 PM PST on November 24, 1971.  In Zulu time, that is 0058 Zulu on November 25, 1971.  Zulu time is 8 hours ahead of PST.

Has nothing to do with me or my typing ... or anyone's typing here.

Georger, are you saying that you did not type in the quotation?  Regardless of how the quotation got into your post, it is wrong.

Anderson was acting as flight engineer on the hijacked aircraft but he was also a NWA pilot.  That is what those three stripes on his uniform sleeves mean.  And I believe that he eventually retired from NWA as a Captain on international flights and flying a 747.

And I am sure that Anderson knew how to tell time and was probably using it in the flight engineer's log he was keeping that day.  And I'll bet that NWA typists were also conversant in the Zulu time system.

So your quotation, wherever it came from, is suspect.

It comes from FBI 302's! There are two sources for these 302's - a guy named Richenbach whoever he is and Geoff Gray.

I am assuming the agent got it wrong. Or two versions of the same notes were typed up maybe at two different offices. Its impossible to know. The info is the same but under two names; Rat vs Anderson.

The rest of the story is these docs do not stand alone but are backed up by other testimony so these two conflicting docs could be thrown out and the same info is still in play. No way to deny that. That is why multiple interviews are always a good thing.

Dont jump to conclusions just because you have a bias to sell.

Georger,

Regardless of how many sources you have for that document, the information is completely wrong.  Only people who have to resort to such false nonsense to support their wild-eyed ideas would have a use for it.

Ok.  ;)