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71
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by EU on July 28, 2021, 03:24:13 PM »
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I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

The other thing to remember, which I consider very important but very easy to overlook, is the fact that the 6k got separated from the other 194k somehow.

Also, if you're right about the FBI Flight Path--of course, which I think is incorrect--then your three possible Tena Bar solutions appear accurate. So yes, pick your poison.
72
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Bruce A. Smith on July 28, 2021, 03:04:05 PM »
I'm glad Fly is diving into this issue. He has sent me a ton o' stuff over the past few days. Some of the tidbits that have impressed me are as follows:

1. The FBI talked to someone about the parachutes early on, perhaps the night of the skyjacking - late though, like 3 am. Was it Cossey? Unclear. What is clear is that Cossey was interviewed by the feds on Friday, 11. 26. 71, and he gave a parachute description that closely matches what the FBI received on 11. 24.71 in the wee hours. But the description that ended up in the Parachute Summary Report, as revealed by Geoffrey Gray in 2011, was in the FBI's hands within hours of the skyjacking.

2. RMB finally offers some valuable information from his two-part interview with Hayden, in which he reveals that Hayden told him he bought the two back chutes in 1968 from a surplus store that got them packed for him by Cossey at Issaquah Sky Sports prior to delivery to Hayden. What RMB has written jibes with what Hayden told me, so I figure it's true. Hayden couldn't remember where or when he bought the chutes when I talked with him in 2014, but he figured it was a surplus supply store, and he had no memory of getting them packed nor of ever meeting with Cossey.
73
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Chaucer on July 28, 2021, 02:54:54 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My dear Chaucer, if the money found at Tena Bar actually came downstream from somewhere around the Portland International Airport area, it would have ended up on the Oregon side of the river.  Water runs down hill which is something you should have learned in English 101.
I said in my post that I wasn't looking to argue about this with either you or Eric. My post was from my perspective that the FBI flight path is accurate. It was not an attack on the WFP or the people who believe in it.

That said, you are objectively wrong about the behavior of marine debris in that part of the river. In fact, a while back, I gave you the contact info for a group of people who actually study that sort of thing. If you had actually followed up and done some research, you'd know better.

Lastly, it's spelled "downhill", not "down hill". That's something you should have learned in English 101.

74
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on July 28, 2021, 02:47:29 PM »
BRAND NEW -  WITH R99'S PERMISSION:

From DZ: (a plausible explanation)

 Both back chute packing cards were packed the same date May 21,1971. they must both represent Hayden's two chutes. The one Hayden got back now at the museum matched one of the cards,,, the other card MUST be from Hayden's other chute, the one Cooper used.

It was staring right at us the entire time.

 

My theory is that Cooper removed the cards and placed the one from the chute he took into the one he left behind.

 

This is huge, they were looking for the wrong chute. This case is wide open now.

 
Edited 2 minutes ago by FLYJACK
75
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on July 28, 2021, 02:38:38 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My dear Chaucer, if the money found at Tena Bar actually came downstream from somewhere around the Portland International Airport area, it would have ended up on the Oregon side of the river.  Water runs down hill which is something you should have learned in English 101.

Again, stop lecturing your inferiors you pompous . . . mind control wont work here! Worst of all it always sidetracks everyone thinking! If thats what you are trying to do - ytou always accomplish that and send people back to watching eagles or playing with something else. YOU ARENOT THE BOSS OF US!

Lets just let r99 BE IN CHARGE. fUCK THIS SHIT.   
76
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on July 28, 2021, 02:37:37 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.

Interesting gambit you make. As of there is something special about your 'theories' people should pay attention to. The other folks are focusing on the chute - the real parachute! The chute Cooper used! Its location will determine the facts of the case vs. all of your half-baked forced assumptions which arent supported by anything real ....

Its science vs. ballyhoo. Data vs Performance art and hair brain ideas !

Georger, science is people digging up the money at Tena Bar.  Ballyhoo is Cossey's confusion about the parachutes.

Stop lecturing your inferiors!    :rofl:
77
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Robert99 on July 28, 2021, 02:37:09 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My dear Chaucer, if the money found at Tena Bar actually came downstream from somewhere around the Portland International Airport area, it would have ended up on the Oregon side of the river.  Water runs down hill which is something you should have learned in English 101. 
78
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on July 28, 2021, 02:36:32 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.

My stance is you cant assume the TBar find by itself is key.

Your premise is an assumption and probably false:  'Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.'
79
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Robert99 on July 28, 2021, 02:31:01 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.

Interesting gambit you make. As of there is something special about your 'theories' people should pay attention to. The other folks are focusing on the chute - the real parachute! The chute Cooper used! Its location will determine the facts of the case vs. all of your half-baked forced assumptions which arent supported by anything real ....

Its science vs. ballyhoo. Data vs Performance art and hair brain ideas !

Georger, science is people digging up the money at Tena Bar.  Ballyhoo is Cossey's confusion about the parachutes.
80
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Chaucer on July 28, 2021, 02:23:08 PM »
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As I suggested during our phone call Bruce, I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. At times people lose sight of the forest through the trees. How does this get us any closer to DBC's identity?

The things described to me by my source make sense. Moreover they are first-hand comments directly from Cossey and may explain some of the problems that appear to exist with the Cossey narrative. But that's about it.

When all is said and done I think it is interesting but means very little. After all, it doesn't change a thing in my mind regarding DBC. That is to say, I believe he landed very near Tena Bar after jumping along the Western Flight Path, buried the cash and other items temporarily, later retrieved the money bag in June 1972, and rolled.

To some degree, I agree with you Eric.

But there is a fundamental need to understand the truth of what the FBI puts in its documents. Are they factual? Accurate? Meaningful?

To fully understand the DB Cooper case, we need to understand the FBI and its investigation. Further, to solve the case we're gonna need truthful, accurate information from the FBI, and that is lacking. Currently, it is often misleading, confused, inaccurate, incomplete, or just plain wrong.

My advice to any serious investigator looking into this case--and it is very good advice--start with the money find at Tena Bar and work back. Tena Bar is a blessing in many respects. It's geography  limits the possibilities greatly. That is why I am so heavily focused on that area and why I think he landed very near there.
I’m in full agreement that the Tena Bar money find is key. However, where we disagree is the flight path. There’s no sense litigating it again. We both know where each of us stand. I will only speak from my perspective.

When the money find is combined with the generally accepted FBI flight path, you have to have a logical explanation for how the money that was in an airliner 10,000 feet over HERE ended up 12 miles west several inches under sand. Now, I have zero doubt about the accuracy of the flight path and believe that it generally followed the course on the yellow map. I know you and R99 will bristle at that. That’s fine, I’m not looking to argue.

My point is that with the plane at Point A, how did the money get to Point B?

There are three explanations:
1. Human intervention. Someone carried a 20+ pound bag of money 12 miles west and buried it on the banks of the Columbia. Or some similar event.

2. Natural intervention. The river is the most likely vehicle here. The money ended up in the water and the water carried it downstream to Tena Bar.

3. Supernatural intervention. Bigfoot killed Cooper, ate the money and then shat it out on the banks of Tena Bar a day or so later. Or Cooper was beamed up mid-fall by a flying saucer and some of the money fell out as it zipped west toward Japan.

Given the fact of the flight path and the fact of the money find, you have to pick your poison. You have to triangulate the most logical explanation for the money to end up where it did. In my mind, that’s via the river.

Not a new or interesting idea, but based on the evidence it’s the right one. Nothing else adequately explains how the money went from the plane to a beach 12 mile west.
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