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21
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on February 15, 2019, 04:36:59 AM »
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Last night, I was watching documentaries about the Zodiac Killer, when I stumbled onto an interesting fact about
how the FBI caught The Golden State killer. The FBI actually used a partial DNA sample and ran it against a public database shared by companies like Ancestry.com and 23andMe.com. The results found a relative that eventually led to the arrest of the killer.

This afternoon the following article popped up on my Facebook feed. Has there been any thought on using this method on the Cooper case?

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Robertrand: The method to catch the Golden State Killer is useful, but they used GED MATCH, a private DNA database to catch him.  They also had a sample of the killer's DNA.  I think a sample was kept from an older case and not intentionally by law enforcement.  For the Cooper case to verify DNA through GED MATCH, they would require a relative of DB Cooper to have uploaded their DNA to GED MATCH, and for the FBI to give up what they have, which they won't do.  The only hope is that someone gets hold of the DNA profiles the FBI has, or a rouge gets it and sends it to GED MATCH.  This assumes the FBI actually has Cooper's DNA.  The good news is that even a third cousin of Cooper could upload their DNA, and that could be used to backtrack to a common relative and then with other evidence, potentially tie the suspect to the hijacking.  I believe in the Golden State Killer case they had a full DNA profile (13 genetic markers).  If the FBI actually has Cooper's DNA from his hair, the cigarette butts, or the tie, and it is not a full profile, say only 6 markers, that may not be enough to match against GED MATCH.  But, with only a few of the 13 markers in place, they could still narrow down the possibilities, but not necessarily get a conviction.  Long response, but we really would need the FBI to give up the DNA.  Wiki Leaks let out a lot of damaging info, but somehow none of those folks thought to release the DB Cooper files.

According to one source who posted and claims to know: 

"Partial or partials?

Multiple contributors?

Yes, yes and yes.

To answer the second question first: Yes there are multiple donors--three--on the tie.

Regarding the first question: All of the DNA related to the three donors is partial.

[Translation: All of the profiles obtained for each donor is a partial profile. ]

Finally, there was one donor who contributed saliva to the tie. It is likely that this is Cooper's DNA given it is easy to envision Cooper smoking, drinking or eating and inadvertently contributing the sample.

None of this explains what happened to the cigarette butts and shaft of hair. Or, why the FBI feels certain enough about their partial DNA profile to publicly exclude Weber and LD by virtue of that DNA while avoiding questions about Sheridan's results."

Who knows how accurate any of this is! Of course we don't know what partial means for any of these profiles? Others go on to claim multiple tests (at least 3) were required for each donor to even obtain a partial in each case! Still SA Carr maintained the profiles they have are good enough to "exclude" people. It's a mess with conflicting stories, but it never prevents Cooperfiles from writing about it ... 

There is another guy who states: "The FBI has 14 partials enough to eliminate but not include..."  ::)

So I pose a question for you: How many loci (in Codis-13) do you consider the minimum for a partial? Which loci do you consider most likely to register after 3 runs? Could we assemble our own 'partial model' as a guesstimate of what the FBI must have at minimum?   



22
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Bruce A. Smith on February 14, 2019, 09:05:29 PM »
This kind of digging (hacking) is best considered to be the prevue of Snowmman.

Snow, can you find us the DNA profiles???
23
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Robertrand on February 14, 2019, 07:37:02 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Last night, I was watching documentaries about the Zodiac Killer, when I stumbled onto an interesting fact about
how the FBI caught The Golden State killer. The FBI actually used a partial DNA sample and ran it against a public database shared by companies like Ancestry.com and 23andMe.com. The results found a relative that eventually led to the arrest of the killer.

This afternoon the following article popped up on my Facebook feed. Has there been any thought on using this method on the Cooper case?

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Robertrand: The method to catch the Golden State Killer is useful, but they used GED MATCH, a private DNA database to catch him.  They also had a sample of the killer's DNA.  I think a sample was kept from an older case and not intentionally by law enforcement.  For the Cooper case to verify DNA through GED MATCH, they would require a relative of DB Cooper to have uploaded their DNA to GED MATCH, and for the FBI to give up what they have, which they won't do.  The only hope is that someone gets hold of the DNA profiles the FBI has, or a rouge gets it and sends it to GED MATCH.  This assumes the FBI actually has Cooper's DNA.  The good news is that even a third cousin of Cooper could upload their DNA, and that could be used to backtrack to a common relative and then with other evidence, potentially tie the suspect to the hijacking.  I believe in the Golden State Killer case they had a full DNA profile (13 genetic markers).  If the FBI actually has Cooper's DNA from his hair, the cigarette butts, or the tie, and it is not a full profile, say only 6 markers, that may not be enough to match against GED MATCH.  But, with only a few of the 13 markers in place, they could still narrow down the possibilities, but not necessarily get a conviction.  Long response, but we really would need the FBI to give up the DNA.  Wiki Leaks let out a lot of damaging info, but somehow none of those folks thought to release the DB Cooper files.

Thanks for the info. I've always wondered what happened to the limb and head hair recovered. Now is the FBI sitting on this evidence or were they disposed off like the cigarettes?
24
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by fcastle866 on February 14, 2019, 06:55:23 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Last night, I was watching documentaries about the Zodiac Killer, when I stumbled onto an interesting fact about
how the FBI caught The Golden State killer. The FBI actually used a partial DNA sample and ran it against a public database shared by companies like Ancestry.com and 23andMe.com. The results found a relative that eventually led to the arrest of the killer.

This afternoon the following article popped up on my Facebook feed. Has there been any thought on using this method on the Cooper case?

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Robertrand: The method to catch the Golden State Killer is useful, but they used GED MATCH, a private DNA database to catch him.  They also had a sample of the killer's DNA.  I think a sample was kept from an older case and not intentionally by law enforcement.  For the Cooper case to verify DNA through GED MATCH, they would require a relative of DB Cooper to have uploaded their DNA to GED MATCH, and for the FBI to give up what they have, which they won't do.  The only hope is that someone gets hold of the DNA profiles the FBI has, or a rouge gets it and sends it to GED MATCH.  This assumes the FBI actually has Cooper's DNA.  The good news is that even a third cousin of Cooper could upload their DNA, and that could be used to backtrack to a common relative and then with other evidence, potentially tie the suspect to the hijacking.  I believe in the Golden State Killer case they had a full DNA profile (13 genetic markers).  If the FBI actually has Cooper's DNA from his hair, the cigarette butts, or the tie, and it is not a full profile, say only 6 markers, that may not be enough to match against GED MATCH.  But, with only a few of the 13 markers in place, they could still narrow down the possibilities, but not necessarily get a conviction.  Long response, but we really would need the FBI to give up the DNA.  Wiki Leaks let out a lot of damaging info, but somehow none of those folks thought to release the DB Cooper files.
25
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Shutter on February 14, 2019, 06:07:11 PM »
I'm guessing he already had an idea from the digging the FBI did and decided to go upstream and see what the layers looked like before the money location....see if anything was different?
26
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on February 14, 2019, 05:45:37 PM »
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It's always been my understanding the trench was not dug on the money location...

TUESDAY Feb 12th
Sifting site
Found fragments under 3 feet of sand in afternoon (Oregonian)
Picture of agents digging up sand on south end half way to beach (Oregonian Wed) Sunny at days end
   
WEDNESDAY Feb 13th
Overcast, no shadows
Backhoe in place
Trench in place
Geologist on scene
Numbered sequence of the bills in the stack still the same (Oregonian)
FBI agent Baker from Portland said bundles were randomized (Oregonian)
“Trench dug 200 ft from site to study layers” (Oregonian Richards thurs)

Your point one above. I think that is correct! That is what Ive been told many times. That's an interesting point. Why did they do that? Nobody has explained that to date so far as I know and I have asked ... ??
27
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Shutter on February 14, 2019, 05:22:39 PM »
It's always been my understanding the trench was not dug on the money location...

TUESDAY Feb 12th
Sifting site
Found fragments under 3 feet of sand in afternoon (Oregonian)
Picture of agents digging up sand on south end half way to beach (Oregonian Wed) Sunny at days end
   
WEDNESDAY Feb 13th
Overcast, no shadows
Backhoe in place
Trench in place
Geologist on scene
Numbered sequence of the bills in the stack still the same (Oregonian)
FBI agent Baker from Portland said bundles were randomized (Oregonian)
“Trench dug 200 ft from site to study layers” (Oregonian Richards thurs)
28
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by Robertrand on February 14, 2019, 03:58:30 PM »
Last night, I was watching documentaries about the Zodiac Killer, when I stumbled onto an interesting fact about
how the FBI caught The Golden State killer. The FBI actually used a partial DNA sample and ran it against a public database shared by companies like Ancestry.com and 23andMe.com. The results found a relative that eventually led to the arrest of the killer.

This afternoon the following article popped up on my Facebook feed. Has there been any thought on using this method on the Cooper case?

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
29
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on February 14, 2019, 03:52:54 PM »
Let me post this photo also - the larger hi-res version of this photo is glorious in its detail. This well known photo was taken in the same series as the strata photo sbove.  This is the black and white version. In this photo Palmer is pointing out the distance between the surface (upper active layer) and the clay-lump (socalled dredging layer) below.

Since everyone says no dredging spoils were even put at this location how in blazes did clay-lump dredging spoils layer even get to this area!  :nono:  Thus Tom thinks Palmer was wrong.   
30
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on February 14, 2019, 03:39:08 PM »
Let me post this also as a followup to the post above. 
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