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1
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by snowmman on Today at 03:22:36 PM »
Ckret's "information" had a long convoluted story about how rubber bands got on the bills, that also included resizing and "hastily prepared"

If you agree that the rubber band story is false, then all of the resizing and "hastily prepared" information should be discarded too, since it came from the same source/interview.

There is no paper trail that talks about resizing bundles.
2
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by snowmman on Today at 03:16:37 PM »
I believe all information from Ckret at Dropzone.com should be considered possibly erroneous.
There is no paper trail talking about rubber bands.

Why do people want to believe Ckret? He was just interpreting docs and interviews in his own way. That was before any docs were released on this matter.

The secrecy of the docs back then, let Ckret ramrod his point of view. Remember, he's just a pole vaulter. There's no reason he represents any kind of expert opinion.

Unless there are more docs we've not seen yet.
3
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by FLYJACK on Today at 03:13:02 PM »
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I suppose I'm reiterating what's been said above. I'll restate it, because it's so astonishing. It blows the myth of rubber bands away, with the some ferocity as the myth of the back rigs coming from Cossey or that the untaken rig was a better choice than the NB6. (i.e. the implication it was a skydiving rig, not just another emergency rig).

I have two additions to prior info. Tina Mucklow's confirmation of the strapping (bank bands) and the erroneous 1980 FBI memo talking about order.

The money that Cooper received was not wrapped in rubber bands.

The only testimony that Cooper received rubber band bundles in random amounts, comes from Larry Carr. Larry Carr has produced incorrect evidence before, notably the source/ownership of the back rigs (which he attributed to Cossey). All of Carr's posting about Cossey and modified NB6 rip and "hard pull" should also be ignored.

My belief is that Carr misinterpreted things, both FBI files and interviews he made. There is no reason to believe that Carr described the money correctly. There is no documentation that supports what he posted in Dropzone.com

The money was not in random amounts per bundle. It was 100 bills per bundle.

The order of the bills in each bundle matched the order in the microfilm. That is an unknown order to us since the published serial number list is not the microfilm order.

The reference to bank bands is paper straps.

There are two documents that back this up.

First a FBI memo. Second Tina Mucklow's interview summary. If people don't have this pdf (from Geoffrey Grey, unredacted), it's part of the files I've recently uploaded to shutter's google drive. He'll probably make all that accessible soon. They've all been OCR'ed for text search.

Both snippets are attached as jpeg due to posting size restrictions, although shutter has the full pdfs.

A third FBI memo in 1980 is interesting. It claims the money was found in the same order as delivered, and in the same packaging. The order would not be known unless the microfiche was checked. Also, rubber bands were not the original packaging.

They also immediately claimed the floating down streams explanation. I think they were just trying to shut down speculation, so the memo doesn't reflect any real facts. I've included the damning snippet.

The memo was sent to multiple FBI offices 2/12/80 the day of the money find press conference.

It's obvious it's wrong, since they couldn't have verified the order like they claimed (time frame, microfiche).

Shutterbug has all the full versions of these in pdf form. (extracted from the source material)

1) FBI memo.
"He" means the Seattle-First National Bank employee. There are not unique rubber bands for Seattle-First and Federal Reserve. Also, it would not be possible to put identifying marks on rubber bands. At least, none that would be reliable. The mention of bank bands here, is another phrase for currency straps that had no other markings other than Seattle-First or Federal Reserve.

On 12/2/71 <redacted> Seattle-First National Bank, Seattle, Washington, advised that the ransom money paid in instant hijacking, was made up of all used 20 dollar bills, selected at random and without sequence.

He stated the bills were made up in packets of $2,000 each and were banded with Seattle-First National Bank or Federal Reserve Bank bands or quite possibly banded with bands from other banks.

No identifying marks were placed on these bands.


2) Muckow Interview
From Tina's interview, summarized in the FBI files that Geoffrey Grey obtained.  Critical page attached. "He" is Cooper. "bank-type bands" are currency straps.

He opened the bag and inspected the contents which Miss MUCKLOW observed was money packed in small packages with bank-type bands around each package.

Having inspected the money in a cursory fashion, the hijacker stated that "it looked okay" and then indicated to Miss MUCKLOW that the crew could now permit the passengers to deplane.


3) FBI Memo 2/12/80 on the money find.
The statement about order and "packaging" should be ignored, since the order could not have been verified. Don't know why they put this out to the FBI offices. (Himmelsbach faulty reasoning?..see stream theory same day)

[On February 10, 1980]...ON AN OUTING WITH THEIR CHILDREN, MR. AND MRS. HAROLD DWAYNE INGRAM OF VANCOUVER, WASHINGTON, DISCOVERED A SUM OF MONEY PARTIALLY BURIED BY SAND IN THE NORTH RIVER BANK  OF THE COLUMBIA RIVER , APPROXIMATELY FIVE MILES DOWN RIVER FROM  THE U.S. INTERSTATE 5 BRIDGE CROSSING BETWEEN PORTLAND AND  VANCOUVER, WASHINGTON.

THE INGRAMS CONTACTED THE FBI AND AN EXAMINATION OF THE BADLY DECOMPOSED $20 BILLS REVEALS THAT THEY BEAR SERIAL NUMBERS IDENTICAL TO A PORTION OF THOSE GIVEN TO THE HIJACKER.

BECAUSE OF THE DECOMPOSED NATURE OF THE BILLS AN  EXACT ESTIMATE OF THE RECOVERED MONEY IS NOT POSSIBLE PENDING A LABORATORY EXAMINATION, HOWEVER, IT APPEARS TO BE SEVERAL THOUSAND DOLLARS.

THE PACKAGING AND THE NUMBERED SEQUENCE INDICATE THAT THE BILLS HAVE NOT BEEN SEPARATED AND ARE IN MUCH THE SAME ORDER AS WHEN GIVEN TO THE HIJACKER.

THE BILLS  WILL BE SENT IMMEDIATELY TO THE FBI LABORATORY FOR ADDITIONAL
EXAMINATION.

IT APPEARS LOGICAL THAT THE PACKAGE OF BILLS COULD HAVE BEEN CARRIED DOWNSTREAM ON ONE OF THE WASHINGTON TRIBUTARIES OF THE COLUMBIA RIVER TO THE SITE WHERE THEY WERE FOUND.
 


The the rubber band frags found may have been from a single bundle, group of packets...

The bank employee must have randomized the bundles (groups of packets), not the individual packets if TBAR was in 100's.

That means the 3 TBAR money "packets" arrived as part of one rubber banded bundle.

No. It means you are inventing facts that dont exist and never existed ...

No packets ........... just bundles ......... just as the bank employee who assembled the bills said.

No need for abstraction and confusion reaching for made up facts you can use to support YOUR SUSPECT! 

One thing we have learned in this monumentally long pointless exercise (which we already knew years ago!), is that the English language has lots of words which can be used for the same thing. BUNDLES - PACKAGES - PACKETS - ETC. All are mass count nouns! Whoopie.

Aren't Linguists good!? See Noam Chomsky for further clarification.   :rofl:   

Bank employee claimed "bundles" not packets..

Then again you repeat your lie..  because you are a scared little ASS...>> a single rubber banded bundle of packets landing on TBAR does not support any specific suspect.

4
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by FLYJACK on Today at 02:56:22 PM »
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There was no need to randomize bundles. They were already sufficiently random with respect to each other, and with respect to the contents of each individual bundle

Rationale:

We have the start/stop serial numbers of 15 unused bundles. When you look at them, you realize the start/stop were "random" when comparing the bundles.

There would be no need to add more randomness, assuming the bundles given to Coop had the same behavior as the bundles not given to him.

The start/stop of the 15 unused bundles. The source of this info has been posted before. It was used to reduce the microfiche list to just the bills given to Cooper, from the original larger amount.
(Note, a prior post identified a disagreement on one serial number in another memo. I think the one ending in 853A? Another list had it ending in 843A)


L41197159A thru E12561828B
L33639577A thru L20458572A
J02051511 thru I00466866
L33410247A thru L32378753A
C05722105A thru G16813690A
G98535159A thru L14348853A (or ...843A in another memo)
L34429987A thru L19556442A

L33M74929A thru L09819218A
L38139808A thru X0093U693
L34346374A thru L33449321A
E503U4994A thru E5Q3M4506A
B07656937B thru L05419634A
E2208M591A thru L66634223B
L52807604A thru L01043096
L19538120A thru L72860402B


The bank employee claimed to have randomized and resized the "bundles" to make look hastily prepared.. Ckret and everyone thought he was referring to the "packets x 100 bills"..

Randomized refers to the size of the bundles aka number of packets not the order of bills. 3, 4, 5 packets per rubber banded "bundle".
5
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by snowmman on Today at 02:51:46 PM »
There was no need to randomize bundles. They were already sufficiently random with respect to each other, and with respect to the contents of each individual bundle

Rationale:

We have the start/stop serial numbers of 15 unused bundles. When you look at them, you realize the start/stop were "random" when comparing the bundles.

There would be no need to add more randomness, assuming the bundles given to Coop had the same behavior as the bundles not given to him.

The start/stop of the 15 unused bundles. The source of this info has been posted before. It was used to reduce the microfiche list to just the bills given to Cooper, from the original larger amount.
(Note, a prior post identified a disagreement on one serial number in another memo. I think the one ending in 853A? Another list had it ending in 843A)


L41197159A thru E12561828B
L33639577A thru L20458572A
J02051511 thru I00466866
L33410247A thru L32378753A
C05722105A thru G16813690A
G98535159A thru L14348853A (or ...843A in another memo)
L34429987A thru L19556442A

L33M74929A thru L09819218A
L38139808A thru X0093U693
L34346374A thru L33449321A
E503U4994A thru E5Q3M4506A
B07656937B thru L05419634A
E2208M591A thru L66634223B
L52807604A thru L01043096
L19538120A thru L72860402B

6
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by georger on Today at 02:44:38 PM »
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I suppose I'm reiterating what's been said above. I'll restate it, because it's so astonishing. It blows the myth of rubber bands away, with the some ferocity as the myth of the back rigs coming from Cossey or that the untaken rig was a better choice than the NB6. (i.e. the implication it was a skydiving rig, not just another emergency rig).

I have two additions to prior info. Tina Mucklow's confirmation of the strapping (bank bands) and the erroneous 1980 FBI memo talking about order.

The money that Cooper received was not wrapped in rubber bands.

The only testimony that Cooper received rubber band bundles in random amounts, comes from Larry Carr. Larry Carr has produced incorrect evidence before, notably the source/ownership of the back rigs (which he attributed to Cossey). All of Carr's posting about Cossey and modified NB6 rip and "hard pull" should also be ignored.

My belief is that Carr misinterpreted things, both FBI files and interviews he made. There is no reason to believe that Carr described the money correctly. There is no documentation that supports what he posted in Dropzone.com

The money was not in random amounts per bundle. It was 100 bills per bundle.

The order of the bills in each bundle matched the order in the microfilm. That is an unknown order to us since the published serial number list is not the microfilm order.

The reference to bank bands is paper straps.

There are two documents that back this up.

First a FBI memo. Second Tina Mucklow's interview summary. If people don't have this pdf (from Geoffrey Grey, unredacted), it's part of the files I've recently uploaded to shutter's google drive. He'll probably make all that accessible soon. They've all been OCR'ed for text search.

Both snippets are attached as jpeg due to posting size restrictions, although shutter has the full pdfs.

A third FBI memo in 1980 is interesting. It claims the money was found in the same order as delivered, and in the same packaging. The order would not be known unless the microfiche was checked. Also, rubber bands were not the original packaging.

They also immediately claimed the floating down streams explanation. I think they were just trying to shut down speculation, so the memo doesn't reflect any real facts. I've included the damning snippet.

The memo was sent to multiple FBI offices 2/12/80 the day of the money find press conference.

It's obvious it's wrong, since they couldn't have verified the order like they claimed (time frame, microfiche).

Shutterbug has all the full versions of these in pdf form. (extracted from the source material)

1) FBI memo.
"He" means the Seattle-First National Bank employee. There are not unique rubber bands for Seattle-First and Federal Reserve. Also, it would not be possible to put identifying marks on rubber bands. At least, none that would be reliable. The mention of bank bands here, is another phrase for currency straps that had no other markings other than Seattle-First or Federal Reserve.

On 12/2/71 <redacted> Seattle-First National Bank, Seattle, Washington, advised that the ransom money paid in instant hijacking, was made up of all used 20 dollar bills, selected at random and without sequence.

He stated the bills were made up in packets of $2,000 each and were banded with Seattle-First National Bank or Federal Reserve Bank bands or quite possibly banded with bands from other banks.

No identifying marks were placed on these bands.


2) Muckow Interview
From Tina's interview, summarized in the FBI files that Geoffrey Grey obtained.  Critical page attached. "He" is Cooper. "bank-type bands" are currency straps.

He opened the bag and inspected the contents which Miss MUCKLOW observed was money packed in small packages with bank-type bands around each package.

Having inspected the money in a cursory fashion, the hijacker stated that "it looked okay" and then indicated to Miss MUCKLOW that the crew could now permit the passengers to deplane.


3) FBI Memo 2/12/80 on the money find.
The statement about order and "packaging" should be ignored, since the order could not have been verified. Don't know why they put this out to the FBI offices. (Himmelsbach faulty reasoning?..see stream theory same day)

[On February 10, 1980]...ON AN OUTING WITH THEIR CHILDREN, MR. AND MRS. HAROLD DWAYNE INGRAM OF VANCOUVER, WASHINGTON, DISCOVERED A SUM OF MONEY PARTIALLY BURIED BY SAND IN THE NORTH RIVER BANK  OF THE COLUMBIA RIVER , APPROXIMATELY FIVE MILES DOWN RIVER FROM  THE U.S. INTERSTATE 5 BRIDGE CROSSING BETWEEN PORTLAND AND  VANCOUVER, WASHINGTON.

THE INGRAMS CONTACTED THE FBI AND AN EXAMINATION OF THE BADLY DECOMPOSED $20 BILLS REVEALS THAT THEY BEAR SERIAL NUMBERS IDENTICAL TO A PORTION OF THOSE GIVEN TO THE HIJACKER.

BECAUSE OF THE DECOMPOSED NATURE OF THE BILLS AN  EXACT ESTIMATE OF THE RECOVERED MONEY IS NOT POSSIBLE PENDING A LABORATORY EXAMINATION, HOWEVER, IT APPEARS TO BE SEVERAL THOUSAND DOLLARS.

THE PACKAGING AND THE NUMBERED SEQUENCE INDICATE THAT THE BILLS HAVE NOT BEEN SEPARATED AND ARE IN MUCH THE SAME ORDER AS WHEN GIVEN TO THE HIJACKER.

THE BILLS  WILL BE SENT IMMEDIATELY TO THE FBI LABORATORY FOR ADDITIONAL
EXAMINATION.

IT APPEARS LOGICAL THAT THE PACKAGE OF BILLS COULD HAVE BEEN CARRIED DOWNSTREAM ON ONE OF THE WASHINGTON TRIBUTARIES OF THE COLUMBIA RIVER TO THE SITE WHERE THEY WERE FOUND.
 


The the rubber band frags found may have been from a single bundle, group of packets...

The bank employee must have randomized the bundles (groups of packets), not the individual packets if TBAR was in 100's.

That means the 3 TBAR money "packets" arrived as part of one rubber banded bundle.

No. It means you are inventing facts that dont exist and never existed ...

No packets ........... just bundles ......... just as the bank employee who assembled the bills said.

No need for abstraction and confusion reaching for made up facts you can use to support YOUR SUSPECT! 

One thing we have learned in this monumentally long pointless exercise (which we already knew years ago!), is that the English language has lots of words which can be used for the same thing. BUNDLES - PACKAGES - PACKETS - ETC. All are mass count nouns! Whoopie.

Aren't Linguists good!? See Noam Chomsky for further clarification.   :rofl:     
7
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by georger on Today at 02:38:14 PM »
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The only additional thought I would put in people's minds:

If Tina looked in a bag that was full of money wrapped only in rubber bands, what would she say?

She would say it was money wrapped in rubber bands.

She would not say "bank-type bands" to a FBI interviewer.

She was not a bank teller, but she was trying to convey her limited knowledge of currency straps. There is no reason to believe Tina would use the phrase "bank-type bands" to describe rubber bands. She also calls the bundles "packages"..showing her lack of bank/money-handling expertise.

Also note that the underlines in the first snippet of my post above, were in the original FBI pdf. There was a 2nd copy of the memo without the markup some FBI agent must have done with pen. It shows that the FBI agent underlined the bank band info, indicating it was important to him.

I think those conclusions are reasonable, if not correct. The reason some agents were concerned with 'bands' is because they were trying to clarify or confirms the Ingram's story which mentioned 'rubber bands'.

As for Tina I think she looked in the bag and saw a bunch of money. I doubt she was too concerned about whether it was bundled or packaged in paper bands vs rubber bands but she said "bank type bands" which could mean rubber or paper. She went over the same testimony several different times with different people and she used the terms bundles and packages, but she said one crucial thing: "small packages of money". 'Small packages' is roughly equivalent to   'small bundles' ... its small assemblages or groups of bills in any event which is what the bank employee said he made. That connects directly with how the Ingrams described what they saw and found at Tina Bar. Thats all that the FBI is concerned with ... consistency in the Ingrams story and whether the order of the bills had been changed since Cooper received them ... 
8
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by FLYJACK on Today at 02:33:43 PM »
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I suppose I'm reiterating what's been said above. I'll restate it, because it's so astonishing. It blows the myth of rubber bands away, with the some ferocity as the myth of the back rigs coming from Cossey or that the untaken rig was a better choice than the NB6. (i.e. the implication it was a skydiving rig, not just another emergency rig).

I have two additions to prior info. Tina Mucklow's confirmation of the strapping (bank bands) and the erroneous 1980 FBI memo talking about order.

The money that Cooper received was not wrapped in rubber bands.

The only testimony that Cooper received rubber band bundles in random amounts, comes from Larry Carr. Larry Carr has produced incorrect evidence before, notably the source/ownership of the back rigs (which he attributed to Cossey). All of Carr's posting about Cossey and modified NB6 rip and "hard pull" should also be ignored.

My belief is that Carr misinterpreted things, both FBI files and interviews he made. There is no reason to believe that Carr described the money correctly. There is no documentation that supports what he posted in Dropzone.com

The money was not in random amounts per bundle. It was 100 bills per bundle.

The order of the bills in each bundle matched the order in the microfilm. That is an unknown order to us since the published serial number list is not the microfilm order.

The reference to bank bands is paper straps.

There are two documents that back this up.

First a FBI memo. Second Tina Mucklow's interview summary. If people don't have this pdf (from Geoffrey Grey, unredacted), it's part of the files I've recently uploaded to shutter's google drive. He'll probably make all that accessible soon. They've all been OCR'ed for text search.

Both snippets are attached as jpeg due to posting size restrictions, although shutter has the full pdfs.

A third FBI memo in 1980 is interesting. It claims the money was found in the same order as delivered, and in the same packaging. The order would not be known unless the microfiche was checked. Also, rubber bands were not the original packaging.

They also immediately claimed the floating down streams explanation. I think they were just trying to shut down speculation, so the memo doesn't reflect any real facts. I've included the damning snippet.

The memo was sent to multiple FBI offices 2/12/80 the day of the money find press conference.

It's obvious it's wrong, since they couldn't have verified the order like they claimed (time frame, microfiche).

Shutterbug has all the full versions of these in pdf form. (extracted from the source material)

1) FBI memo.
"He" means the Seattle-First National Bank employee. There are not unique rubber bands for Seattle-First and Federal Reserve. Also, it would not be possible to put identifying marks on rubber bands. At least, none that would be reliable. The mention of bank bands here, is another phrase for currency straps that had no other markings other than Seattle-First or Federal Reserve.

On 12/2/71 <redacted> Seattle-First National Bank, Seattle, Washington, advised that the ransom money paid in instant hijacking, was made up of all used 20 dollar bills, selected at random and without sequence.

He stated the bills were made up in packets of $2,000 each and were banded with Seattle-First National Bank or Federal Reserve Bank bands or quite possibly banded with bands from other banks.

No identifying marks were placed on these bands.


2) Muckow Interview
From Tina's interview, summarized in the FBI files that Geoffrey Grey obtained.  Critical page attached. "He" is Cooper. "bank-type bands" are currency straps.

He opened the bag and inspected the contents which Miss MUCKLOW observed was money packed in small packages with bank-type bands around each package.

Having inspected the money in a cursory fashion, the hijacker stated that "it looked okay" and then indicated to Miss MUCKLOW that the crew could now permit the passengers to deplane.


3) FBI Memo 2/12/80 on the money find.
The statement about order and "packaging" should be ignored, since the order could not have been verified. Don't know why they put this out to the FBI offices. (Himmelsbach faulty reasoning?..see stream theory same day)

[On February 10, 1980]...ON AN OUTING WITH THEIR CHILDREN, MR. AND MRS. HAROLD DWAYNE INGRAM OF VANCOUVER, WASHINGTON, DISCOVERED A SUM OF MONEY PARTIALLY BURIED BY SAND IN THE NORTH RIVER BANK  OF THE COLUMBIA RIVER , APPROXIMATELY FIVE MILES DOWN RIVER FROM  THE U.S. INTERSTATE 5 BRIDGE CROSSING BETWEEN PORTLAND AND  VANCOUVER, WASHINGTON.

THE INGRAMS CONTACTED THE FBI AND AN EXAMINATION OF THE BADLY DECOMPOSED $20 BILLS REVEALS THAT THEY BEAR SERIAL NUMBERS IDENTICAL TO A PORTION OF THOSE GIVEN TO THE HIJACKER.

BECAUSE OF THE DECOMPOSED NATURE OF THE BILLS AN  EXACT ESTIMATE OF THE RECOVERED MONEY IS NOT POSSIBLE PENDING A LABORATORY EXAMINATION, HOWEVER, IT APPEARS TO BE SEVERAL THOUSAND DOLLARS.

THE PACKAGING AND THE NUMBERED SEQUENCE INDICATE THAT THE BILLS HAVE NOT BEEN SEPARATED AND ARE IN MUCH THE SAME ORDER AS WHEN GIVEN TO THE HIJACKER.

THE BILLS  WILL BE SENT IMMEDIATELY TO THE FBI LABORATORY FOR ADDITIONAL
EXAMINATION.

IT APPEARS LOGICAL THAT THE PACKAGE OF BILLS COULD HAVE BEEN CARRIED DOWNSTREAM ON ONE OF THE WASHINGTON TRIBUTARIES OF THE COLUMBIA RIVER TO THE SITE WHERE THEY WERE FOUND.
 


The the rubber band frags found may have been from a single bundle, group of packets...

The bank employee must have randomized the bundles (groups of packets), not the individual packets if TBAR was in 100's.

That means the 3 TBAR money "packets" arrived as part of one rubber banded bundle.
9
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by georger on Today at 02:25:38 PM »
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packets of bundles of packets must = packages of packets of bundles of packets ?

Could we call them Tundles?

just ch4ecking ...   

when does a bundle become a packet become a package? Since it is claimed these are all OFFICIAL BANKING TERMS

why don't you read the FBI files... the "Bank" refers to 100's as packets, not bundles

looks like a paste up job to me! Are you faking documents now to show here?

Projection now Georger, you were caught "Faking" evidence.

If you actually read the FBI docs you'd know they are legit... your persistent denial has entered the twilight zone.

Look Buddy - do your fakery some place 4lse4.

You posted a paste up[ as evidence. You are caught. Confess!


That is three FBI docs together.. all showing use of "packets". Can you read?

You are just being a troll.

.

Post the whole documents dufuss. Its the fashion. All the girls are doing it! Follow fashion and conventions for a change.

Docs have been posted many times, you are just being an ASS...

another complaint filed against - FLYJACK!

How many is that now for the DB Cooper Forum Name Caller?

 :nono: :rofl:
10
DB Cooper / Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last post by FLYJACK on Today at 02:14:53 PM »
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packets of bundles of packets must = packages of packets of bundles of packets ?

Could we call them Tundles?

just ch4ecking ...   

when does a bundle become a packet become a package? Since it is claimed these are all OFFICIAL BANKING TERMS

why don't you read the FBI files... the "Bank" refers to 100's as packets, not bundles

looks like a paste up job to me! Are you faking documents now to show here?

Projection now Georger, you were caught "Faking" evidence.

If you actually read the FBI docs you'd know they are legit... your persistent denial has entered the twilight zone.

Look Buddy - do your fakery some place 4lse4.

You posted a paste up[ as evidence. You are caught. Confess!


That is three FBI docs together.. all showing use of "packets". Can you read?

You are just being a troll.

.

Post the whole documents dufuss. Its the fashion. All the girls are doing it! Follow fashion and conventions for a change.

Docs have been posted many times, you are just being an ASS... 
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