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DB Cooper / Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Last post by Unsurelock on Today at 05:17:58 AM »
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Message from Bryan at the Ariel store today - I had asked Bryan if he (and his Mom) knew anything about the Ariel store robbery... here is Bryan's reply.

"Hi Jerry...

Thanks Bryan!

Gee, I do recall being given a lot of crap for using proper names here. Can't remember by whom...
DB Cooper / Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Last post by Unsurelock on Today at 04:07:32 AM »
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You two speechless heroes have just demonstrated perfectly that you have dedicated years to a snipe hunt with no hope of gaining anything from this line of inquiry.  :bravo:

Still inviting answers.

Ok poster. Go back to 2005-08 and start reading every post at DZ; in other words read the thread. Or, go to Google and find a synopsis of the DB Cooper hijacking and read it. Like this:   You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

DB Cooper / Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Last post by Unsurelock on Today at 04:06:33 AM »
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I've stated that without knowing the correct flight path it is impossible to determine the correct landing zone. Furthermore, if we can determine the landing zone we are well positioned to answer some basic questions if not solve the entire mystery.

Why do I say this?

First, considering the basic questions, if we can accurately identify where DBC landed it can tell us how the money arrived at Tena Bar and by extension whether DBC survived.

Second, considering solving the entire mystery, it is very reasonable to assume that the two parachutes DBC jumped with--if not the attache' case and money--are still out there yet-to-be found. Finding any of these items may well help determine DBC's identity. For example, if we find the attache' case we could likely identify when and where it was purchased (within a certain range). Finding the parachutes may provide some additional clues too.

Also, finding the parachutes or attache' case--not to mention a body--would also enable us to measure the veracity of the FBI's assumptions in some areas. Specifically, if we find DBC's parachutes near the Western Flight Path that would put a fork in the FBI Flight Path--apparently finding the money on Tena Bar was not sufficient to do the same.

You've hit upon an important point, which is to say that one would think if anything was still out there that it would have been found. After all, the area has been lived in, hunted and clear cut for a mighty long time. Considering this, the mere fact that nothing has been found is a clue in-and-of-itself by my way of thinking. It leads me to conclude that the items were either stashed underwater or in a place like the Ridgefield National Wildlife Refuge (not coincidentally along the Western Flight Path).

Beyond all of this, it's just cool. Indeed, the mystery is 50% figuring out what actually happened, and 50% figuring out who the guy was.

I agree that it's a cool story, hopefully without sounding like I'm glorifying a criminal. But beyond that...

If Cooper's parachutes are found minus Cooper, people will claim they are not Cooper's. Those who say they are Cooper's will be divided into camps of those who believe he landed at that spot and those who believe he landed somewhere else, and the parachutes were moved by some means. Some will say that Tina Mucklow planted them there because her conscience got to her after so many years of being a silent accomplice. Others will say Cooper came back and planted them there to toy with the FBI, anywhere from one to fifty years later.

If a body is found in a parachute harness with a briefcase and road flares with $190k on him, matching serial numbers, still wearing the loafers and even the damn sunglasses, people will say it's too good to be true so it's a setup.

There was a Cooper researcher named George Nuttall who, along with a partner, spent exorbitant amounts of their final years on this earth walking around islands in the Columbia River, convinced that Cooper had landed on one of them and that his remains had been scattered about by scavengers, thus explaining why nobody had found a corpse.  That's pretty specific and pretty sad that they reached that conclusion based on nothing at all, then committed to it with all their retired energy.

Now, with all of that in mind, from a practical standpoint, if we could magically determine and agree upon a landing zone, what then? Will the bickering stop? Will everyone agree on what that means for the other evidence? Will Flyjack say the landing zone proves Cooper must have survived while Shutter says Cooper definitely died, and Georger posts this icon  :rofl:  And calls them both stupid?  I think yes, yes and yes.  So again, what are our goals?

Let's say the landing zone puts Cooper further West than originally thought. The landing zone is still huge, part on land and part on water. Scenario 1: Cooper landed right in the fucking Columbia. POW. Unconscious. Drowned. Money floated up on Tena bar, yes? Or perhaps not. Secnario 2: Cooper impaled himself anus-first onto a conifer and was discovered by a gas station worker taking a leak in the woods. Dude took all of the money and over time lost or buried some of it, only after burying Cooper so nobody would know someone local took the money. Scenario 3: Coop got his Chute open and drifted gently toward a riverbank, landing on it, rolling up his chute and hoofing it off to safety, ditching his money after seeing cops. Scenario 4: he came back to twirl his moustache and plant the money on that beach. Scenario 5: Cooper's money defied all odds, and I mean all odds, deciding to hang back and let Coop rot and tumble downstream, all casual without his tie. The money grew hands and feet, walked up the riverbank, and after stacking itself nicely, buried itself in the sand.

It doesn't matter where the landing zone was. All of these are possibilities to the people obsessed with this case. Nuttall's partner had been a cop who had seen a body distributed by wildlife about the countryside. That is why he felt so strongly that THIS HAS TO BE what happened to Cooper. We all think we're special and we have the center-of-the-universe type answer that all others lack.

So again, what are the goals in establishing a landing zone?

For me, I'm gonna stick to the money and the math.  The tie could have been anybody's, and was exposed to decades of an FBI evidence room where it could have been contaminated countless times. The landing zone is entirely meaningless. The parachute chosen is meaningless with only four possibilities to choose from, the level of skill in jumping is virtually meaningless, and all investigation up to now has been completely and utterly worthless. The answer is someplace the public hasn't looked, and I don't mean some overlooked clump of trees near Ariel.
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by georger on March 27, 2020, 11:45:46 PM »
I was surprised to hear today on Darren's podcast, that SA Larry Carr is still following the Cooper case?  According to EU, apparently Carr is commenting on Eric Ulis' Facebook page about the Cooper case?  Apparently Mr. Ulis and Mr. Carr have been in contact for some time? 

It's too bad Carr won't come here and answer a few questions! He has an open invitation -  :chr2:

 vote the smileycode and safe 
DB Cooper / Re: The Cooper Vortex Podcast
« Last post by georger on March 27, 2020, 05:33:00 PM »
Its generally my policy not to comment on Cooper podcasts, but in this one instance I will say a few things, to set the facts straight!

1. If the Army analyst or statistician, or whatever he is contacted me and I came back 'uninterested' then something is wrong. Analytical work would have been exactly the kind of thing I would be interested in .... so I have no idea what went wrong or why, because as far as I am concerned his statistical analysis of the money distribution in the general population (at banks etc) is one of the most interesting things I heard in this podcast. Im a little sorry we didn't connect to communicate because some of his ideas might have been put to the test - we might know more today than we do! That could prove to be a loss. That person's work could be very valuable in this case! He commented that this kind of statistical work might have been very valuable (crucial) earlier in the case! I could not agree more.  I appreciated everything he had to say!  I dont know what more to say..

2. Tom Kaye was not the tenth or eleventh guy I called looking for someone to do SEM work on the money. He was the first, in the general public! We knew who Tom was and something about his capabilities, his lab capabilities, and he was in a favorable section of the country for expedited delivery of bills from Seattle to Arizona and basic analytical work we wanted. Had Tom said "no", I/We had other lab options. Our forensic mandate from Larry Carr was to analyze the money looking for anything that would shed light on several basic questions. That was our only forensic mandate and the only reason I got involved. I was not looking to become involved in a 'fishing expedition' involving the whole DB Cooper case! When Tom was selected we had no idea he would take on the whole case - that came as a total surprise and I/We dropped out, leading to Tom forming his own 'science team'. The rest is history. The forensic part of the Cooper case has prospered under Tom and Larry's direction. I dont think anyone can seriously argue with that ...     

3. Tom Kaye is not a diatom expert, or a Columbia diatom expert or he would already have shaped his comments differently - and neither are the other panelists speaking on this subject. From my perspective that is obvious and it is adversely affecting the whole discussion so far. Real experts need to be involved (somehow), or the whole discussion about diatoms on the Cooper money is going to be flawed.             
DB Cooper / Re: The Cooper Vortex Podcast
« Last post by EU on March 27, 2020, 09:18:30 AM »
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I couldn't load it. I chased all over the Internet to the Vortex to Facebook, but nothing ran. Wassup?

Try this link Bruce:

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DB Cooper / Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Last post by haggarknew on March 27, 2020, 06:25:04 AM »
Dirty rotten criminal..... Himms stated it best.
DB Cooper / Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Last post by Bruce A. Smith on March 27, 2020, 04:51:43 AM »
That's a good way to put it.
DB Cooper / Re: The Cooper Vortex Podcast
« Last post by Bruce A. Smith on March 27, 2020, 04:46:09 AM »
I couldn't load it. I chased all over the Internet to the Vortex to Facebook, but nothing ran. Wassup?
DB Cooper / Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Last post by nickyb233 on March 27, 2020, 04:00:45 AM »
Seems like Tina was more comfortable with a hijacker on her plane with a bomb then the media. Go to 1:40 on this (she looks very rattled here) . Tina was so nervy and took over got praised for it but I see a different demeanor here.
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