Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

Author Topic: Tena Bar Money Find  (Read 1192701 times)

georger

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3705 on: January 13, 2018, 02:07:04 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
One of the agents excavating described how when they were raking they uncovered what at first appeared as a 'piece of driftwood' - but on examination it turned out to be a soft 'fist sized' clump of rotted money. This has been referenced before. As here:

"One article states that the money "looked like a piece of driftwood" - and had young Ingram offering it up to Dad as firewood before they realized what it was. Another article addresses further searches in the area found fragments and an FBI agent says he found a "fist-size clump of wadded up $20 bills" that appeared like driftwood." (Smokin99 DZ)

Lots of people were seeing lots of driftwoods. Little driftwoods and bigger driftwoods. All planted like seeds on the beach. Perhaps directed by the Cooper Cartel with Farmer's Almanac in hand.  ;)

Would you mind pointing to those fist-sized clumps? I'm having a hard time seeing them here in the FBI's fragment snuff boxes:


Maybe Shutter will answer you? Where is Shutter?

Your posts are clear. You seem to be trying to identify and eliminate any and all data that stands in the path of a plant theory. Why go through all of these preparatory steps. Just post your (and Galen's) plant theory in all of its parts, and get this over with?   

« Last Edit: January 13, 2018, 05:06:12 AM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4365
  • Thanked: 465 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3706 on: January 13, 2018, 02:30:32 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Why were the Ingram’s on the beach in February?  Why would they be on Any beach in February in the Pacific Northwest.   And the boy just happened to be digging in that one spot?  That’s some coincidence.  Lol!  Has anyone checked the Ingram’s phone records from the Fall of ‘71?

So, what do you do for fun with the kids on a Sunday in February, Sammy?

Roasting hot dogs sounds good to me!
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3707 on: January 13, 2018, 06:35:00 AM »
Quote
Your dumb ass still hasn't answered my last few questions to you, and now this?  I smell methane every time you talk, gramps.


This is what I have to wake up too?

I've locked the thread down once again, and will take further action once I've returned from work..
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3708 on: January 13, 2018, 08:29:58 PM »
The money find is full of unanswered questions..when you watch the 1980 video they claim $3,000 was found on Sunday. It also claims a small piece of a stack was found..One agent is quoted saying “ a formless fist size clump of money he describes as a wadded up bunch of $20 bills” do you see any photo's of that? Two reports claim $3,000 was found by the Ingram's and more money found on Tuesday and Wednesday by the FBI..the truth is in this somewhere..

Some of it could of stayed in Washington and never returned to Seattle..most of the physical evidence stayed in Nevada. Butts, cups, hair sample etc.

Robert Blevins whines about not seeing, or testing the Amboy chute and tried to say Tom Kaye was denied access to it...as you read some of the 302's lots of chutes were found over the years. Do you see photo's of all of those? Tom told me it never crossed his mind to ask about it since it was found not to belong to the case...one chute was found on top of a garbage can..a couple in the Columbia etc.

Tom also explains the holes in the money. I seriously doubt it was done by a ice pick, or termites. Are we implying the money was a waste of time by allowing it to sit somewhere and let termites eat it, then get rid of it on a beach years later, really? The bills also look like they are a hundred years old, but that's not the case either, is it?

If Cooper was as smart as most of you claim. He would of easily got rid of the money and profited from his actions. This is all based on the fact of him surviving which nobody can prove at this time. That's another frustrating part of the case...dead or alive? The FBI has mentioned several times the money could of gone undetected..it appears Cooper knew everything else in the world, except this?

Now, we all need to get along here, or I'm going to start deleting members, not just giving vacations like the one that will apply today. Running a forum is not easy, just ask Robert Blevins. He was shut down again for terms of service violations. That's like his 6th attempt at running a forum.

Name calling will NOT be tolerated..fighting fire with gasoline never works..I realize we all flex our brain muscles here trying to outsmart one another. I think it's a lot simpler proving, or challenging the facts presented vs attacking the person presenting a theory..

This case has gone on for decades unsolved..it's not going to be easy to solve, or that would have been done years ago..lets work the problem vs creating a problem?

Shutter
 
The following users thanked this post: Mack

FLYJACK

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3709 on: January 15, 2018, 09:47:55 AM »
Took some screen grabs of a video I have,,


First pic of bundle is NOT termite damage but from water damage, it is hard like a brick and interesting to see the rubber bands.

The other two pics are termite damage only, dry environment.. (not water, not buried)

Looks similar to these..
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 10:30:34 AM by FLYJACK »
 
The following users thanked this post: Lynn

Offline dice

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 268
  • Thanked: 40 times
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3710 on: January 15, 2018, 10:13:22 AM »
I need to add to my earlier statement....  re termites.   
I mentioned that the termites tend to tunnel..and I am speaking from experience in owning a  1902 built house...
HOWEVER, I totally forgot about this...that once in early summer, i left a small piece of I think a 2 x 4 or some wood, on the side lawn...and it must have been there a month, and I pick it up and its being annihilated on the underside of it where its sitting and compressing in the dew and grass making contact with the soil, and tons of termites were almost uniformly going to work on it on its bottom side.  It wasn't a typical experience where they bore a tunnel, because it was an entire army. So apparently when the water is present they can come en masse and eat at once... but when it is completely dry, that is when they tunnel, as they have to go back to drink.  And that was disturbing to see these clear ants chomping away.     Having said that, one needs to appreciate the RATE of consumption of termites...and therefore only can add, that IF the bundle was attacked by termites, the unsub MUST have caught them in the act after a short period of time, because otherwise there'd be nothing left, THAT you can be sure of.
Purdue 38  Iowa 36
 

FLYJACK

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3711 on: January 15, 2018, 10:29:21 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
I need to add to my earlier statement....  re termites.   
I mentioned that the termites tend to tunnel..and I am speaking from experience in owning a  1902 built house...
HOWEVER, I totally forgot about this...that once in early summer, i left a small piece of I think a 2 x 4 or some wood, on the side lawn...and it must have been there a month, and I pick it up and its being annihilated on the underside of it where its sitting and compressing in the dew and grass making contact with the soil, and tons of termites were almost uniformly going to work on it on its bottom side.  It wasn't a typical experience where they bore a tunnel, because it was an entire army. So apparently when the water is present they can come en masse and eat at once... but when it is completely dry, that is when they tunnel, as they have to go back to drink.  And that was disturbing to see these clear ants chomping away.     Having said that, one needs to appreciate the RATE of consumption of termites...and therefore only can add, that IF the bundle was attacked by termites, the unsub MUST have caught them in the act after a short period of time, because otherwise there'd be nothing left, THAT you can be sure of.

Theoretically,
The termites may have consumed almost all of the bills, only about $6000 was found. We don't know what happened to the rest of it..  if the money was attacked by termites somewhere, it is unlikely that the TBAR money was the only "bundle".

Another note, there are many termite species with very different sizes, characteristics and behaviours.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 10:29:40 AM by FLYJACK »
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3712 on: January 15, 2018, 10:39:14 AM »
OK - guys where are we discussing this - in what thread - we cant be jumping around between two threads.

 

georger

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3713 on: January 15, 2018, 10:57:29 AM »
I will post in this thread a reply -

Flyjack I dont think the math is on your side. Termites tunnel. As they go they feed 3 dimensionally creating a large tunnel as they go. The book examples are a case in point. What you see as a termite "tunnel"  .. in one single bill -  would only be .0043 inches wide! That is not a termite TUNNEL! That is just a missing piece of one bill  :)

Moreover, all of the found bundles would be ~1.247 inches wide, uncompressed. No termite is going to eat one single .0043" bill and leave other adjacent bills alone.

Let me download all of the auction bill images and examine them but, those I have looked at clearly show missing portions are due to fracturing, not termite eating pattern. Virtually every bill Ive looked at shows internal fracturing deep into the bill - these margins will define the next piece missing ... it has nothing to do with some eating pattern of an insect.

I just dont see the termite eating pattern you see and I think the math bears this out. What I see is fracturing and missing pieces of bills are missing because pieces fractured away, not because these missing pieces were eaten away by some insect. A missing piece of one bill only .0043" thick is not a termite eating pattern. Its because of fracturing.

The fact of fracturing throughout this money raises some interesting questions related to time and thermal conditions, structure and chemistry of paper currency, etc. None of this has anything to do with termites. The time it takes for this paper threads to dry and fracture in a static condition through seasonal thermal changes and drying-wetting, might just yield an estimate of the time this money was stationary at Tina Bar and experienced atomic fracturing and breakage? Its one entry point into a time estimate .... there are others.

Let me get all of the auction images downloaded and I will be back ... later.       
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 11:08:38 AM by georger »
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3714 on: January 15, 2018, 12:31:48 PM »
Does anyone here recall me saying (over and over again!) that objects left in Nature tend to get rounded at the corners, and rectangular objects tend to lose not just corners but mass at the entire margins of the object tending toward an ellipsoid shape? Here is a clear cut example of this in the Cooper bills - an image at the Ingram auction page.

Notice the graying/thinning of the bill's mass all around the periphery of the bill. This is a concrete example of what I am talking about.

All of the Ingram bills show this effect. Anywhere where continuous energy is applied you get loss in mass. (mass/heat conversion). Tom had already documented some torquing of the bills. (perhaps top bills nearest flowing water?) In any event, torquing places stress (energy) on the middles of bills which would tend to cause wear in the middles resulting in bills breaking into two pieces near the middles. This is simple applied physics. 
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 12:51:06 PM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3715 on: January 15, 2018, 04:22:03 PM »
again, some of you imply that Cooper was smart as a whip...then believe he allowed his hard earnings to rot away as if he realized he couldn't spend the money after getting away?...basically, he did the crime to prove it could be done?

did Cooper dig a huge hole and start trimming the bills and dropping them in the sand as he covered the hole back up?
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3716 on: January 15, 2018, 04:55:02 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
again, some of you imply that Cooper was smart as a whip...then believe he allowed his hard earnings to rot away as if he realized he couldn't spend the money after getting away?...basically, he did the crime to prove it could be done?

did Cooper dig a huge hole and start trimming the bills and dropping them in the sand as he covered the hole back up?

/basically, he did the crime to prove it could be done?/

That was exactly what a lot of people thought at the time. A political stunt-message to The Man.   

 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3717 on: January 15, 2018, 05:02:12 PM »
He should of just burned the money then?
 

Offline DavidV

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 33
  • Thanked: 13 times
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3718 on: January 15, 2018, 05:13:48 PM »
Been going through the last few pages on this thread. So if I missed it for give me.
All the bills at Tina Bar were found with rubber bands, not those paper "bank bands" correct?
 

FLYJACK

  • Guest
Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #3719 on: January 15, 2018, 05:28:56 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Been going through the last few pages on this thread. So if I missed it for give me.
All the bills at Tina Bar were found with rubber bands, not those paper "bank bands" correct?

Ingrams took the money home and claimed "rubber bands around the packages", they broke apart. No evidence of bank bands.

This conflicts with Tina and bank letter to FBI both claiming bank bands..  However, bank bands may have deteriorated very quickly or were somehow missing from that bundle... just another contradiction in the Cooper Vortex.
 
The following users thanked this post: DavidV