Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

Author Topic: Tina Bar Money Find  (Read 496732 times)

Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5550 on: September 13, 2020, 03:06:27 PM »
Truck in the background of Tom's photo.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5551 on: September 13, 2020, 03:07:44 PM »
could be the media..they had a lot of equipment on the beach..even the FBi.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2020, 03:10:15 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5552 on: September 13, 2020, 04:52:01 PM »
Tom, I know you believe the dredge layer Palmer shows is possibly the core of Tbar, or should I say you believe it's possible..

My question would be..we have normal tides coming in on a daily basis. they don't reach the money location. only flooding and high water events do this. wouldn't it make sense that if dredge material was placed there prior to Nov. 71 that it would still exist, especially the further you get away from the source of erosion. it's obvious the currents and tides play a role in the coastline disappearance but shouldn't affect the area above the waterline. would there really be a need to place material there prior to 1980 and before 71. this was originally brought up by Eric..

Did the Fazio's ever say what they did with the southern spoil?
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5553 on: September 13, 2020, 05:26:34 PM »
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Truck in the background of Tom's photo.

There is another truck in the wooded area just to the right of the two kneeling people in the left foreground.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5554 on: September 13, 2020, 11:06:56 PM »
Looking further into dredging on the Columbia shows the sand actually belongs to Washington and Oregon. the Army Corps. maintain the river. you have easements on the riverbanks that belong to the state. this is one of the reasons you just can't do as you wish. regulations are in place for the dredging process and placement of the sand.

The Fazio's have been in business since the 50's. they sell the sand vs using it for placement. they have a 17 acre deposit site on the south end of Tbar. a pipe is in place that goes out to the Columbia for the runoff. it has to be 20 feet below the surface for environmental reasons. all of this had to be approved. they sell 90,000 cubic yards a year..He’s had offers to move much more, but it’s not in his business plan.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2020, 11:10:13 PM by Shutter »
 
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5555 on: September 13, 2020, 11:18:01 PM »
While reading about the Fazio's closing Tbar off to the public he mentions this tidbit..

The Columbia drops to 4.38 feet in July and mostly stays below that height until about Thanksgiving, according to tables compiled by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.

« Last Edit: September 13, 2020, 11:18:26 PM by Shutter »
 
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Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5556 on: September 13, 2020, 11:34:21 PM »
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Truck in the background of Tom's photo.

There is another truck in the wooded area just to the right of the two kneeling people in the left foreground.

I see that now ... and the one car I circled is two vehicles... 
 

Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5557 on: September 13, 2020, 11:59:25 PM »
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Aerials of 1979, 1984...

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Here is 1979 cropped to the Fazio area - it doesnt look right somehow ?
« Last Edit: September 14, 2020, 12:00:35 AM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5558 on: September 14, 2020, 12:08:26 AM »
Depends on the time it was taken...it's not the same period as the 79 photo we have..
 

Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5559 on: September 14, 2020, 12:09:31 AM »
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Depends on the time it was taken...it's not the same period as the 79 photo we have..

I know but it bothers me ...  :rofl:

Tried to get JT and others in Oregon today - no luck!
« Last Edit: September 14, 2020, 12:10:23 AM by georger »
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5560 on: September 14, 2020, 12:24:22 AM »
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Depends on the time it was taken...it's not the same period as the 79 photo we have..

I know but it bothers me ...  :rofl:

Tried to get JT and others in Oregon today - no luck!

Based on a couple of small shadows, the picture seems to have been taken in the mid- to late morning.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5561 on: September 14, 2020, 12:25:18 AM »
I'm wondering what month...a noticeable change in beach coverage can be seen between the two..

Looking at them side by side is starting to present problems..

The same photo in the PDF marked 1979 is dated 1978 on Vancouver's website..it does say "mixed" could be 78 & early 79..I don't know..good catch G.

Update..looking further on Vancouver's site it's labeled June 1978..
« Last Edit: September 14, 2020, 01:05:11 AM by Shutter »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5562 on: September 14, 2020, 02:19:14 AM »
Found a thread in regards to the Fazio's closing off the beach...lots of angry fishy guys..these are the people to talk to. they know all about Tbar..

Quote
was down by there yesterday and they fenced the whole beach off with no tresspass signs every 8' or so. the average high water mark(top of burm) is about 25' up the hill. you could see debris in the barb wire fence from the rivers tide/ level going up and down.

Quote
It is possible to own tide rights, which will allows the land owner to remove people from their property. Also, a portion of the land is a private fishing club and we should all respect that. There have been reports of people down there that have been or are mistreating his property; leaving trash, starting fires, etc.. Before you press your luck, and get the law involved I would recommended doing some research and respecting the land.

Post dated 6-12-2013
Quote
Considering the flows at Vancouver are mearsured for river height in that area, it's been averaging around 8ft so it's true you would be above the 4.3ft line. As of today they are at 5.95ft at Vancouver... Come summer time they'll drop to 1-4ft pending tide height.....
Although this was one of my favorite places to fish and a beach that was unknown for summer for the most part, its now rediculous how many people have barraged that beach... Loose lips sink ships, and this one is going under....... Keith

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« Last Edit: September 14, 2020, 02:46:05 AM by Shutter »
 
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5563 on: September 14, 2020, 02:10:00 PM »
Moving sand from spoils is no easy task. especially if the spoil is not near the area. to apply one foot of sand in the area of the money location would require close to 800 cubic yards of material if you base this on an area 300 feet long by 70 inland with a depth of 12 inches. that's about 80 dump truck loads worth. possibly more since the trucks were much smaller than today. these numbers are probably on the light side since you would probably grade the sand from high to low.

Without all the dredging records it's hard to speak of facts. we do know they checked and stated only one operation occurred on Tbar. 1960 shows a huge spoil where the northern spoil was placed in 1974. this one was almost 700 feet long. that's like combining both 74 spoils together.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2020, 02:10:54 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5564 on: September 15, 2020, 07:37:17 PM »
Another historical peak chart...1977 is on here but not on the list?