Author Topic: New Forum & News Updates  (Read 687427 times)

Offline Lynn

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Thanked: 57 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6750 on: February 06, 2020, 06:51:56 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
R99--You're right, I should do that. Hopefully I don't come off as completely nuts.
Oh, you won't! I'm in a FB group that's been looking into the William Desmond Taylor murder in 1922, which for a case with basically 4 major suspects and their cohorts is crazy complex. A lot of scouring Ancestry, census records, military records, and some fascinating stuff found. One group that is very seriously looking at the case, trying to sort the wheat from the Hearst chaff fact-wise, is considering applying to exhume an unidentified body of a suicide victim that was found back then and that may have been one of the missing suspects. You're not digging up bodies, just records, and people in that field tend to understand people's fascinations with historical minutiae - especially in such a well-known case. I don't have an Ancestry account myself, but if I could log in with yours I might be able to hack away a little at your list in my free time; unsure how much time I could put in but as you're chipping away at it, I'm sure a few little bits here and there could help. Would need a clear list of parameters.
 
The following users thanked this post: andrade1812, Robert99

Offline Lynn

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Thanked: 57 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6751 on: February 06, 2020, 07:41:02 PM »
Re: Cattle mutilations, UFOs, and views of the Universe: On the cattle I have no real opinion, apart from wondering why the aliens would care to mutilate so many of them. If they're advanced enough to get to Earth, the biology of a cow should be something they could figure out with a couple of carcasses, so probably not them doing research. If they're sucking blood, I don't see why one couldn't as easily say vampires, though I can more readily imagine other life in the universe than vampires existing since whenever on Earth. Unless they're really evolved mosquitoes.

Someone's already shown how the crop circles can be made without tracks leading away; probably a society of mischievous Engineering students.

UFOs I don't worry about so much one way or the other; I reckon we've got enough to worry about with humans and natural disasters and rent and stuff. I did see some lights once at twilight I couldn't explain, so I did some Googling and matched what I saw with various explicable light formations in the sky, and one matched perfectly. So I take no stand on UFOs apart from thinking most reports are explicable by non-alien phenomena. I think aliens could exist, given the size of the Universe, but if they're really experimenting on us, they seem to be taking their sweet time about it. I mean, honestly, we're just diabolically clever apes, and even we puny humans have more or less gotten the gist of apes. And why bring people back and re-abduct them? Why not just keep them? People go missing all the time, and the people looking for them don't usually accuse aliens first, so the aliens could pretty much keep their subjects if they wanted to. Hell, they could just come clean - they'd probably get people volunteering, or donating other people just to get rid of them. But I don't completely dismiss the idea of UFOs, it's just not something I think about much or worry about at all. 

Re: Inter-dimensional beings - no way to really know for sure about other dimensions, physically too large a question for  science to test in any rigorous way, though of course Quantum Physics has some theoretical physicists who posit other dimensions/parallel universes, etc. If they're advanced beings, though, they probably wouldn't need to pick and probe at individual humans, IMHO.

Re: Gods vs. dust in the wind (dude), I was raised RC, and though I left, it's hard to completely shake a sense of incompleteness without some form of spirituality, though I do believe most holy books are largely symbolic and you're really not gonna improve much on Taoism. Atheist, agnostic, or otherwise, Infinity seems pretty much a given; and immortality exists at least insofar as we are made of energy and energy cannot be destroyed, only transformed. Whether what it transforms into is also conscious is up for grabs and can't be proven. Something had to go bang for the big bang, and that little something may have just popped into existence like a rogue electron, but it had to have popped into somewhere. Whether the Universe had consciousness in its infancy, nobody knows. Perhaps it evolved consciousness, but as we are in fact part of what is all one thing, and are conscious, the universe has consciousness now at least insofar as we (and other creatures) do. That does not mean it understands itself or consciously controls the evolution of anything, however, any more than we consciously control our bodies' autonomic systems.

I have my own made-up theology, which I call a placebo - I don't need to fully believe it's true; placebos work, it's been proven, often even in cases where the subject doesn't fully believe in the placebo but tells themselves they do. It's mostly just to help me stay calm and carry on. I'm pretty cool with what anyone wants to believe as long as they don't use their belief to abuse others or trample on the freedoms of those who don't believe what they do. Cults are another matter. There's a famous one in the US and beyond- which shall remain nameless because they love lawsuits, but I'm sure you all know who I mean, and they are greed and evil incarnate.
 
The following users thanked this post: andrade1812, Robert99

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 589
  • Thanked: 82 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6752 on: February 07, 2020, 12:28:34 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Okay.

In the meantime, though, what were those Phoenix Lights?

BTW: What are your thoughts on who's doing those cattle mutilations?

Google AeroVironment, Inc. and check out their aircraft and a customer of theirs in the late 1990s.  Give them a call and if they blow you off, I'll fill in some of the details just from what I have seen on cable TV.

I would not classify cattle mutilations as involving anything supernatural.  Also, I would classify the people who tramp down crop circles in the middle of the night, which apparently is centered mainly in England, as people who have to much free time on their hands.

Google AeroVironment first so that you know what I am talking about.  Then we can discuss some details.  I'll defer to 377 on the cattle mutilations.   
 

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 589
  • Thanked: 82 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6753 on: February 07, 2020, 12:46:49 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Re: Cattle mutilations, UFOs, and views of the Universe: On the cattle I have no real opinion, apart from wondering why the aliens would care to mutilate so many of them. If they're advanced enough to get to Earth, the biology of a cow should be something they could figure out with a couple of carcasses, so probably not them doing research. If they're sucking blood, I don't see why one couldn't as easily say vampires, though I can more readily imagine other life in the universe than vampires existing since whenever on Earth. Unless they're really evolved mosquitoes.

Someone's already shown how the crop circles can be made without tracks leading away; probably a society of mischievous Engineering students.

UFOs I don't worry about so much one way or the other; I reckon we've got enough to worry about with humans and natural disasters and rent and stuff. I did see some lights once at twilight I couldn't explain, so I did some Googling and matched what I saw with various explicable light formations in the sky, and one matched perfectly. So I take no stand on UFOs apart from thinking most reports are explicable by non-alien phenomena. I think aliens could exist, given the size of the Universe, but if they're really experimenting on us, they seem to be taking their sweet time about it. I mean, honestly, we're just diabolically clever apes, and even we puny humans have more or less gotten the gist of apes. And why bring people back and re-abduct them? Why not just keep them? People go missing all the time, and the people looking for them don't usually accuse aliens first, so the aliens could pretty much keep their subjects if they wanted to. Hell, they could just come clean - they'd probably get people volunteering, or donating other people just to get rid of them. But I don't completely dismiss the idea of UFOs, it's just not something I think about much or worry about at all. 

Re: Inter-dimensional beings - no way to really know for sure about other dimensions, physically too large a question for  science to test in any rigorous way, though of course Quantum Physics has some theoretical physicists who posit other dimensions/parallel universes, etc. If they're advanced beings, though, they probably wouldn't need to pick and probe at individual humans, IMHO.

Re: Gods vs. dust in the wind (dude), I was raised RC, and though I left, it's hard to completely shake a sense of incompleteness without some form of spirituality, though I do believe most holy books are largely symbolic and you're really not gonna improve much on Taoism. Atheist, agnostic, or otherwise, Infinity seems pretty much a given; and immortality exists at least insofar as we are made of energy and energy cannot be destroyed, only transformed. Whether what it transforms into is also conscious is up for grabs and can't be proven. Something had to go bang for the big bang, and that little something may have just popped into existence like a rogue electron, but it had to have popped into somewhere. Whether the Universe had consciousness in its infancy, nobody knows. Perhaps it evolved consciousness, but as we are in fact part of what is all one thing, and are conscious, the universe has consciousness now at least insofar as we (and other creatures) do. That does not mean it understands itself or consciously controls the evolution of anything, however, any more than we consciously control our bodies' autonomic systems.

I have my own made-up theology, which I call a placebo - I don't need to fully believe it's true; placebos work, it's been proven, often even in cases where the subject doesn't fully believe in the placebo but tells themselves they do. It's mostly just to help me stay calm and carry on. I'm pretty cool with what anyone wants to believe as long as they don't use their belief to abuse others or trample on the freedoms of those who don't believe what they do. Cults are another matter. There's a famous one in the US and beyond- which shall remain nameless because they love lawsuits, but I'm sure you all know who I mean, and they are greed and evil incarnate.

I think I could identify the cult you mention on my first guess. 

On the theology matter, the several Laws of Thermodynamics, which are the best proven laws in science, can be interpreted as showing that the universe as we know it had a beginning and will eventually have an end.  My college thermodynamics professor pointed this out during a class and also pointed out that this is the exact opposite of the theory of evolution.  Some scientists don't like this interpretation.

I'll grant you that there are probably living beings elsewhere in the universe but somewhere beyond Pluto.

The "Phoenix Lights" that I mentioned to Bruce Smith are not as mysterious as you might think.  There is a rational explanation for them (or maybe just "it").
 
The following users thanked this post: Parrotheadvol, andrade1812

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3518
  • Thanked: 204 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6754 on: February 07, 2020, 05:05:25 PM »
Lynn, that's quite a treatise of EVERYTHING that you have posted here. Fun to read.

I was raised RC, too. Sigh, and I led my first act of revolution in 5th Grade by protesting Weekend Homework. One night at the convent I started shouting my protests about Mother Michaeline's policies. It got me expelled. Mom had to apologize, and pleaded to get me re-instated...

BTW, your comments on consciousness reminded me of the central tenet of the New Physics - that asks what role consciousness plays in the formation of reality. By extension, consciousness is often touted as thinking, thoughts, emotions, etc. - all the attributes of human "awareness," and Sir Roger Penrose has famously said that any theory of reality that does not include human thought is incomplete. I agree with Sir Roger.

BTW II: I agree with your assessment of the role of "aliens" in the cattle mutilation phenomenon. One would think that beings capable of getting here from their Planet X would have pretty fancy bio/genetics labs back home and not need cow parts from our sweet Terra.

BTW III: I also agree with your speculations on abductees - why bring them back? Why not just keep them!!! Hence, I believe that all abductions are mental and memory constructions that engineer a psychological response within us. At least, that's my understanding of my "abductions."
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3518
  • Thanked: 204 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6755 on: February 07, 2020, 05:08:55 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
(#1) I think I could identify the cult you mention on my first guess. 

(#2) The "Phoenix Lights" that I mentioned to Bruce Smith are not as mysterious as you might think.  There is a rational explanation for them (or maybe just "it").

Number 1: I vote for Scientology!
Number 2: Robert, why are you keeping us in such suspense? !!!
 

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 589
  • Thanked: 82 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6756 on: February 07, 2020, 05:21:11 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
(#1) I think I could identify the cult you mention on my first guess. 

(#2) The "Phoenix Lights" that I mentioned to Bruce Smith are not as mysterious as you might think.  There is a rational explanation for them (or maybe just "it").

Number 1: I vote for Scientology!
Number 2: Robert, why are you keeping us in such suspense? !!!

Bruce, go to wikipedia and look up and read "AeroVironment".  This will help you understand the "Phoenix Lights".  You have described your self as an "investigative reporter" so you should understand the need for this.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3518
  • Thanked: 204 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6757 on: February 07, 2020, 05:27:13 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Google AeroVironment first so that you know what I am talking about....
 

Okay. So AeroV is a heavy-duty defense contractor specializing in drones. including battery powered and solar-powered craft. So, you're saying/implying that the Phoenix Lights were a fleet of drones?
« Last Edit: February 07, 2020, 05:32:21 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3518
  • Thanked: 204 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6758 on: February 07, 2020, 05:34:18 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Bruce, go to wikipedia and look up and read "AeroVironment".  This will help you understand the "Phoenix Lights".  You have described your self as an "investigative reporter" so you should understand the need for this.


Understanding my "needs" is a life-long pursuit, as is my effort to understand your need for evasiveness.
 

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 589
  • Thanked: 82 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6759 on: February 07, 2020, 07:42:34 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Bruce, go to wikipedia and look up and read "AeroVironment".  This will help you understand the "Phoenix Lights".  You have described your self as an "investigative reporter" so you should understand the need for this.


Understanding my "needs" is a life-long pursuit, as is my effort to understand your need for evasiveness.

Have you read the wiki part about the solar powered aircraft?
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3518
  • Thanked: 204 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6760 on: February 08, 2020, 04:52:10 AM »
Yes.
 

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 589
  • Thanked: 82 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6761 on: February 08, 2020, 03:06:20 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Yes.

Great.  What follows is a very brief discussion of what the "Phoenix Lights" probably were.  But first a full disclosure.  I actually lived in the Phoenix area on March 13, 1997.  However, I was on a lengthy trip away from Phoenix on that date and did not see this event myself.  Further, I would classify most of the reports on this event as the result of mass hysteria or wild-eyed hyperactive imaginations.  And I believe there was only one aircraft involved and that it originated on the planet Earth and was designed, built, and operated by normal human beings.

The aircraft in question was seen in the Prescott area by personnel who viewed it as it passed between the observer and the moon.  It blanked out the moon as it passed and this means it was a physical object (no clouds involved).  The aircraft was very slow moving and eventually made its way to the Phoenix area.  The Phoenix area is where most of the observations were made.  It was observed to have about 6 or 7 light sources (maybe more) that sometimes blinked off and on.

In due time, the aircraft was south of Phoenix and was photographed by a ground camera as it passed between the camera and the moon.  This photography was included in a cable TV program that aired several years ago and which I saw.  In this photography, it was obvious that the aircraft was at a very low altitude, maybe only a few hundred feet above the ground, and very slow moving.  It was also obvious that about the rear half of the object was covered by a transparent material and the internal wing structure could be seen.

Based on the aircraft's low altitude, rate of descent, and slow speed, it is my guess that it probably hit the ground between Phoenix and Casa Grande and perhaps on the Gila River Indian Reservation.

In the 1990s, AeroVironment made a number of one-of-a-kind flying wing aircraft that fit the above description.  They were solar powered and had about 6 to 8 propellers.  The rear half of he wing was covered by Mylar (think industrial strength Saran wrap) and the top of the wing had solar panels.  These aircraft were very slow, about 50 to 75 MPH, and could reach extreme altitudes (50,000+ feet).  They were controlled from the ground and perhaps could be pre-programmed for a specific flight path.

My guess is that one of these aircraft was being tested in Nevada and had mechanical and/or electrical issues and basically made it off the reservation.  If it could not recharge its batteries, it would gradually descend.  The lights on the propeller nose cones blinking on and off from time to time would mean that the electric propeller motors was running out of electricity.  There is no way that an aircraft dropping flares could explain what was observed here.

In the late 1990s, AeroVironment was working on some interesting projects according to their company information.  This incident is probably one that they would not want to advertise or publicly comment on when it happened.  And it would be just one aircraft.

The aircraft would be a straight edged flying wing and not a V-shaped structure.  There are no aerodynamic or structural reasons for it to have a V-shape and plenty or reasons for it not to have such a shape.  Also, it was not one mile wide as some reports claim.  That claim can be dismissed out of hand as absolute nonsense.  Also it never hovered and didn't come from some distant planet.  Propellers don't work very well in a vacuum.

I realize that the above will probably anger some True Believers, but that is their problem and not mine.     
 

Offline 377

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1622
  • Thanked: 364 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6762 on: February 08, 2020, 04:13:44 PM »
One thing to keep in mind is that without knowing the dimensions of a UFO it’s nearly impossible to estimate it’s size or range/altitude. Two observers viewing the same object in the sky could attribute vastly different sizes and distances to it. They are really just guessing. When you see an airliner overhead you can give a reasonable estimate of its altitude because you know the approximate dimensions. With unknown objects, it’s very difficult to distinguish between a small object that is close and a larger object that is more distant.

377


« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 04:14:41 PM by 377 »
 
The following users thanked this post: Robert99

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 589
  • Thanked: 82 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6763 on: February 08, 2020, 04:55:53 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
One thing to keep in mind is that without knowing the dimensions of a UFO it’s nearly impossible to estimate it’s size or range/altitude. Two observers viewing the same object in the sky could attribute vastly different sizes and distances to it. They are really just guessing. When you see an airliner overhead you can give a reasonable estimate of its altitude because you know the approximate dimensions. With unknown objects, it’s very difficult to distinguish between a small object that is close and a larger object that is more distant.

377

True.  The one mile wide claim can be ruled out by the simple fact that the largest aircraft built to date were the dirigibles which were built in Europe and the USA in the 1920s and 1930s.  Ever last one of them had severe problems with weather.  None of them were longer than about 1000 feet and basically they just proved that aircraft that size were not suitable for practical use.  Something a mile wide would be somewhere beyond horrendous.

Based on the fact that I could actually see the internal wing structure in the video of the aircraft which was taken south of Phoenix, a good approximation of its size and speed can be made.  Don't forget that the size of the moon was also visible in that video.  And these estimates are sufficiently accurate to suggest that AeroVironment built it since they are the only known USA company that has built such aircraft.   
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 04:58:13 PM by Robert99 »
 

Offline 377

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1622
  • Thanked: 364 times
Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6764 on: February 08, 2020, 05:26:25 PM »
I was privy to then classified DOD programs years ago. Canadair made a Very odd looking military surveillance drone that had coaxial contra rotating rotors in the middle of a vertically oriented structure. It generated some wild but actually fairly accurate descriptions from people who thought they were seeing some alien craft. This was long before drones were a common sight.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

377
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 05:28:12 PM by 377 »