Author Topic: New Forum & News Updates  (Read 601385 times)

Offline Robert99

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6480 on: November 07, 2019, 01:38:39 AM »
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Here is a paste up using newspaper clippings about Tosaw, Farflung put together. One clipping mentions Tosaw's belief that the Cooper money was deposited on Tina Bar by the dredging in 1974 . . .  Tosaw believed Cooper landed in the Columbia and died, upstream of Tina Bar.

So Tosaw believed that the airliner bypassed Portland on the western side?  I'm sure that Georger will still claim otherwise.

Keep making stuff up.

Any progress on those "packets" and the money "container"?  Did Tom or the FBI find container threads in the money? Be sure to let us know.

Any pizza pie from Sky Chef in the money "packetolas"?

Georger, you are the one making stuff up.
 

Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6481 on: November 07, 2019, 02:04:46 AM »
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Here is a paste up using newspaper clippings about Tosaw, Farflung put together. One clipping mentions Tosaw's belief that the Cooper money was deposited on Tina Bar by the dredging in 1974 . . .  Tosaw believed Cooper landed in the Columbia and died, upstream of Tina Bar.

So Tosaw believed that the airliner bypassed Portland on the western side?  I'm sure that Georger will still claim otherwise.

Keep making stuff up.

Any progress on those "packets" and the money "container"?  Did Tom or the FBI find container threads in the money? Be sure to let us know.

Any pizza pie from Sky Chef in the money "packetolas"?

Georger, you are the one making stuff up.

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you want to be a celebrity that's your problem.  :rofl:

Any news about The Donner Party ?
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 02:13:00 AM by georger »
 

Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6482 on: November 07, 2019, 03:21:48 AM »
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wing dams...I think Tosaw covered those. I think a small chute was found in one?

Galen says that he and Tosaw found a pilot chute on a wing dam just upstream from T-Bar. But my sense is that Tosaw was going for the Grand Salami by finding DBC's body in the deeper channels of the river.

Bruce, here is your story/announcement from 2012 'announcing' that Galen Cook and Tosaw find pilot chute ! Nothing about Cook swimming with the Raineys, finding the chute with the Raineys, etc. Why is this 1988 discovery being announced by you and Cook in 2012 ? The discovery was announced to the world in 1988! Your assertion that Galen says that he and Tosaw found a pilot chute on a wing dam may be factually wrong. In fact on a radio program Cook asserts he found out about the pilot chute discovery after Tosaw died, when he (Cook) inherited files from the Tosaw estate. That's quite different from being a part of the original discovery ? In fact, Tosaw died 9/16/2009. Files finally passed to Cook around 2012? Then you wrote your article in 2012. That is a long separation from the discovery of the pilot chute by Curtis Rainey clear back in .... 1988 .... with news coverage at the time.

"Galen Cook revealed last year (2012) on Ground Zero that a 2-3 foot diameter “pilot” chute was discovered near Tena Bar in 1988, just one mile upstream from the money find. The chute was found by Richard Towsaw’s team and it was also revealed that fishermen in the area had found shredded $20 dollar bills upstream from the Ingram find at Tena Bar."
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** I am not sure Tosaw or Cook were even present when the Raineys found the pilot chute. Cook's name was not mentioned by anyone including the Raineys, and neither Cook or Tosaw were present for the press conference and news release on Nov 26th, and press people tried to reach Tosaw for comment through his office in California. Others including Cossey however were involved and interviewed on Nov 26th after the discovery of the chute on Monday Nov 21st by the Raineys.   

Here is your article:

"The Hunt for DB Cooper – Disclosure of parachute find at Tina’s Bar fuels interest in baffling case
Posted on November 19, 2012 by brucesmith49
by Bruce A. Smtih


 A 2-3 foot diameter “pilot” chute was discovered near Tina’s Bar in 1988, just one mile upstream from the money find, investigator Galen Cook has announced this week.

 Although this information had been reported in a local newspaper at the time, it had never been carried by major media outlets and subsequently has gotten lost in 40 years worth of investigatory dust.
 Nevertheless, Cook said that several different DB Cooper sources had recently provided bits of the pilot chute story, and he felt the 41st anniversary of the skyjacking was an ideal moment to re-release the information, updating its meaning with the weight of recent findings.

 This disclosure is the second major piece of information the distinguished DB Cooper sleuth has delivered this week, and Cook’s announcement comes just days after he declared that two men had found shards of $20 bills at Tina’s Bar one month prior to Brian Ingram’s discovery $5,800 worth of skyjacking money in February, 1980.
 The information concerning the pilot chute comes from several different sources.  Cook said that Richard Tosaw is the primary focal point of the discovery, and that in 1988 a diving team he asssmebled – led by Curtis Rainey – had located the chute snagged on a “wing dam” about a mile upstream from Tina’s Bar.
 Wing dams are wooden structures designed to trap sediment and slow the aggregation of soils in the river channel, much like a jetty or rock groin.

 Richard Tosaw died in 2009, and Cook said that he discovered references to the pilot chute find recently in notes provided to him from the Tosaw family.

 Pilot chutes, which are found on most parachutes, are a small canopy about 2-3 foot in diameter and are designed to pop out of a parachute bag when the rip cord is pulled.  The pilot chute is spring-loaded, according to diving expert and DB Cooper aficionado Mark Metzler, and it helps pull the main parachute out of the container.

 “All emergency bailout rigs, such as the ones provided to DB Cooper, would have a pilot chute,” Metzler said.
 Cook says the pilot chute that Tosaw’s crew found was discovered in about 20 feet of water and mostly buried in river bottom mud.  The pilot chute is about 2-3 feet in diameter and made of nylon, and it is reportedly constructed in a rugged fashion.  It is currently in the possession of the Tosaw family.

 Corroborating the Tosaw family notes is a DB Cooper expert known as “Georger” on the DropZone website, the most popular forum on the Internet exploring this intriguing case.

 Cook says that “Georger” has recently sent him a November 23, 1988 clipping from a Vancouver, WA newspaper by Associated Press reporter Bob Bauman that describes the pilot chute find as presented in the notes provided by the Tosaw family.  The newspaper account lists the specific location of the find as Caterpillar Island.

 The newspaper report also states that the pilot chute was evaluated by Earl Cossey, the widely-known but controversial parachute rigger intimately associated with the DB Cooper case, and who allegedly provided Northwest Orient Airlines with the parachutes the skyjacker used in his getaway.

 Cossey reportedly claimed that the pilot chute found by Tosaw was not one that would have been part of the chutes that he gave to NWO because the stitching and materials indicated it was from an earlier era.

 Cook says that he has spoken recently with Cossey, who confirmed his prior opinion that the pilot chute was not part of the NB-8 or Pioneer “luxury type” parachutes that Cooper received.
It is not believed that Cooper cannabalized another back chute for its pilot canopy as both Cossey and a second individual, acrobatic pilot Norman Hayden, who both claim to have provided the chutes Cooper used, also report that they got their second, unused chutes back from the FBI.

 In an associated development, Cook also says that he has received information supporting his announcement from last year regarding the “fiery object” phenomena.  Specifically, Cook says that two more Vancouver residents now report seeing a burning object over their city’s sky at 8 pm on the night of the skyjacking.  This buttresses Cook’s earlier claim that a “Janet” had seen a red, glowing object leave a low-flying jetliner the evening of November 24, 1971, and arc its way towards Tina’s Bar.

 “Janet” further claims that she saw a ladder or stairway underneath the aircraft and possibly saw a man climbing down.  Presumably this occurred as the plane flew overhead at 10,000 feet and through rain clouds.
 This claim has been dubbed “the fiery object phenomenon” and has been widely derided, although Mr. Cook firmly believes “Janet’s” story despite its far-fetched nature.  Now, however, her tale may have supporting evidence.
 Cook feels that DB Cooper may have made an “escape kit” from the briefcase that contained his bomb, and that it included a neatly folded pilot chute which he deployed as he exited the aircraft.  Cook also speculates that the briefcase may have held other items needed in Cooper’s jump, such as the knife that was used to cut shroud lines off one of the reserve chutes that were subsequently used to lash the money bag.

 Cook wonders if the bomb in the briefcase was a fake explosive device, and the whole package was actually a collection of road flares that Cooper used to burn all of his evidence and-or provide some illumination of the landscape beneath him.

 “I’ve talked with a number of military jumpers – commando types – and they all tell me that jumping at night in total darkness is very tricky,” Cook says.  “They tell me that they drop flares routinely to see a silhouette of the ground – to see if they’re coming up on a building or a tree.  They told me that anything, even a road flare, is better than nothing.”

 Others support that perspective.

 “But just dropping a flare is worthless,” Metzler told the Mountain News.  “Using a canopy to give a flare some ‘hang-time’ is a smart move.”

 What is indisputable is that Cooper’s briefcase and its contents have never been found, and the fate of these items is one of the enduring mysteries of the crime.

 However, if any of these speculations are true the implications are enormous, as it means DB Cooper did not exit his aircraft over Washington and waited until he was above Oregon.  This is in sharp contrast to the strongly held belief, especially by the FBI, that Cooper jumped much further north – over Ariel, Washington about 25 air miles north of Vancouver.

 Another strange element of this case is that Galen worked extensively with Richard Tosaw – on the shores of Caterpillar Island and elsewhere from 2005 onward – even trudging in waders on the very wing dam that Tosaw had found the pilot chute almost twenty years before.  Yet, Tosaw never mentioned the finding.

 “Tosaw did not tell us everything he knew!” exclaimed Galen.  Ironically, the Janet story also comes from an archival search of the deceased Cooper sleuth’s notes – long held under a similar veil of secrecy.
 ©  2012  Bruce A. Smith    "


« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 03:56:38 AM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6483 on: November 07, 2019, 04:26:09 AM »
It's always good to re-read my writing. Thanks, G. I guess what's posted above is the actual pilot chute story, and I conflated what Galen has told me over the phone since that time with these events, leading me to believe there was a second pilot chute.

Okay. One pilot chute. 1988. Tosaw's dredge crew found it.

I'll have to ask Galen to re-visit his wadin' in da water with Tosaw story.

Galen has been a busy boy over the years - he was mucking around the wing dams with RT AND he walked the entire length of Caterpillar Island, up 10 100-150 inland. Impressive.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 04:27:58 AM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

Offline haggarknew

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6484 on: November 07, 2019, 04:55:35 AM »
Does anyone know which wing dams were searched? There were (are?) wing dams on both sides of the river aren't there?
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6485 on: November 07, 2019, 11:43:19 AM »
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Does anyone know which wing dams were searched? There were (are?) wing dams on both sides of the river aren't there?

There are wing dams all over the place.  The ones that would relate to the Cooper matter would be downstream (to the North) of Tina Bar.  It is not likely that any wing dam upstream (to the South) of Tina Bar would snag anything related to Cooper.
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6486 on: November 07, 2019, 11:46:20 AM »
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Here is a paste up using newspaper clippings about Tosaw, Farflung put together. One clipping mentions Tosaw's belief that the Cooper money was deposited on Tina Bar by the dredging in 1974 . . .  Tosaw believed Cooper landed in the Columbia and died, upstream of Tina Bar.

So Tosaw believed that the airliner bypassed Portland on the western side?  I'm sure that Georger will still claim otherwise.

Keep making stuff up.

Any progress on those "packets" and the money "container"?  Did Tom or the FBI find container threads in the money? Be sure to let us know.

Any pizza pie from Sky Chef in the money "packetolas"?

Georger, you are the one making stuff up.

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you want to be a celebrity that's your problem.  :rofl:

Any news about The Donner Party ?

Georger, you are the one who is wasting everyone's time.  Just exactly what are you doing, or think you are doing, to resolve the Cooper hijacking?  You ignore facts and make silly posts.  When will your Cooper book be out?
 

Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6487 on: November 07, 2019, 02:37:56 PM »
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Here is a paste up using newspaper clippings about Tosaw, Farflung put together. One clipping mentions Tosaw's belief that the Cooper money was deposited on Tina Bar by the dredging in 1974 . . .  Tosaw believed Cooper landed in the Columbia and died, upstream of Tina Bar.

So Tosaw believed that the airliner bypassed Portland on the western side?  I'm sure that Georger will still claim otherwise.

Keep making stuff up.

Any progress on those "packets" and the money "container"?  Did Tom or the FBI find container threads in the money? Be sure to let us know.

Any pizza pie from Sky Chef in the money "packetolas"?

Georger, you are the one making stuff up.

Stop wasting everyone's time. If you want to be a celebrity that's your problem.  :rofl:

Any news about The Donner Party ?

Georger, you are the one who is wasting everyone's time.  Just exactly what are you doing, or think you are doing, to resolve the Cooper hijacking?  You ignore facts and make silly posts.  When will your Cooper book be out?

So post em if you got em! Start by posting a photo of the wingdams being discussed. Be relevant and on-topic for a change!  8)  And stop your persecutions. I could care less about your state of mind . . . . .  :chr2:
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 02:49:56 PM by georger »
 

Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6488 on: November 07, 2019, 03:21:25 PM »
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It's always good to re-read my writing. Thanks, G. I guess what's posted above is the actual pilot chute story, and I conflated what Galen has told me over the phone since that time with these events, leading me to believe there was a second pilot chute.

Okay. One pilot chute. 1988. Tosaw's dredge crew found it.

I'll have to ask Galen to re-visit his wadin' in da water with Tosaw story.

Galen has been a busy boy over the years - he was mucking around the wing dams with RT AND he walked the entire length of Caterpillar Island, up 10 100-150 inland. Impressive.

Well Bruce, the issue is history ... not a publicity campaign for Cook, you. or anyone else. Because its quite obvious neither you or Cook or Tosaw are the whole story or even the whole truth!

Your description of the Raineys as "Tosaw's dredge crew" is not even factual! The Raineys were independent contractors with their own company. The Raineys were well known contractors who had previously worked with salvage companies, the government, etc. Tosaw had no expertise on the Columbia - he was a newcomer and a stranger to the Columbia and its 'ways'. Tosaw had no expertise in diving. Galen Cook is 100% irrelevant to this whole story! And so are you.  ;)

You owe it to at least know what you are talking about, if you are going to play "investigative reporter" ?

As I have explained, it starts with the finding of money at Tina Bar. Word spread quickly through the area and in the diving-salvage community. Several salvage people made direct offers to the FBI and offered them help. There is a whole story about that . . . you have missed. The Tosaw story is a minor part of the larger story of people searching the Columbia for anything related to DB Cooper. You and Cook have somehow missed that completely! Galen Cook may have played around with Tosaw part of one summer but Galen Cook is not part of the larger search story.

It takes a certain knowledge of the Columbia to search the Columbia and its environs at all. The Raineys were part of that community of experts. Tosaw was a newbe and completely dependent on the Raineys and others ... and Galen Cook isnt even a part of that story! Galen Cook was off spinning yarns on radio programs.

So, when you give yourself and Cook and Tosaw credit for 'finding the pilot chute etc' ... you are completely full of crap and ignoring the real story of people searching the Columbia ... without doing regular press and radio interviews!

It appears Galen Cook didn;t even know about the finding of the pilot chute in 1988 or the Janet story, until he received documents from the Tosaw estate around 2012, after Tosaw died in 2009. Galen Cook had nothing to do with the actual finding of the pilot chute. Did he ever meet the Raineys at all?

The fact is salvage people and other experts offered the FBI help in searching the Columbia in 1980. That started a whole chapter of searches on the Columbia for anything related to the Cooper case.

Why dont you and R99 tell us all about it!  Here is a map to start you on your mission. 
 
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 03:31:28 PM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6489 on: November 07, 2019, 03:31:47 PM »
Georger, Stop It. Your hostility is unwarranted and counter-productive.

I made an anecdotal comment or two about the wing dams, and that information is at variance to what you know. Clearly, your knowledge on the subject of the wing dams, the Raineys, etc. is extensive. I acknowledge that, and value your contributions to these issues. But I do not deserve to be lambasted.
 

Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6490 on: November 07, 2019, 03:34:17 PM »
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Georger, Stop It. Your hostility is unwarranted and counter-productive.

I made an anecdotal comment or two about the wing dams, and that information is at variance to what you know. Clearly, your knowledge on the subject of the wing dams, the Raineys, etc. is extensive. I acknowledge that, and value your contributions to these issues. But I do not deserve to be lambasted.

Well you have people pissed due to your misrepresentation of actual history people participated in!

File a complaint with Ramtha Investigative Reporter Rights Office.  :o

You might also back up and start telling history like it actually was! You and Cook arent even part of that story.

* Just imagine that you are a long time salvage operator on the Columbia - actually part of a community of such people - and you suddenly hear that the FBI is down at Tina Bar tearing things up! You run your boat down to T_Bat and start talking to people, asking questions, and this leads to a long discussion about how one might search the whole area including the Columbia for anything related to NORJAK. A call is made a shortly other salvage people show up and the discussion expands. At length the Raineys are brought into this.... there are technical discussions about property lines, legal rights, jurisdictions, etc and at the end of the day everyone is curious about what the Columbia itself might yield and where to look and how to look. ............................................  Tosaw isnt even a part of that story. Galen Cook? Who is he?  That is where the real story begins. . . . 
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 03:46:27 PM by georger »
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6491 on: November 07, 2019, 05:24:52 PM »
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Georger, Stop It. Your hostility is unwarranted and counter-productive.

I made an anecdotal comment or two about the wing dams, and that information is at variance to what you know. Clearly, your knowledge on the subject of the wing dams, the Raineys, etc. is extensive. I acknowledge that, and value your contributions to these issues. But I do not deserve to be lambasted.

Bruce, don't get your hopes up.  Georger has been going off the deep end for the last 10 years that I have personal knowledge of.
 

Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6492 on: November 07, 2019, 05:53:10 PM »
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Georger, Stop It. Your hostility is unwarranted and counter-productive.

I made an anecdotal comment or two about the wing dams, and that information is at variance to what you know. Clearly, your knowledge on the subject of the wing dams, the Raineys, etc. is extensive. I acknowledge that, and value your contributions to these issues. But I do not deserve to be lambasted.

Bruce, don't get your hopes up.  Georger has been going off the deep end for the last 10 years that I have personal knowledge of.
Bottom feeding Nonesense. Sell it to Blevins and Galen Cook. Redirect your thoughts to the DB Cooper case.  :-*

Show us the wingdams that were searched in the 1980s if you even know? Contribute something constructive for a change? My guess is you dont know, or care. You are here to sell a personal narrative and nothing else? 
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 05:58:07 PM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6493 on: November 07, 2019, 10:01:32 PM »
I wonder if Cooper went through any R&D like this guy did  :rofl:

.
 
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Offline georger

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Re: New Forum & News Updates
« Reply #6494 on: November 07, 2019, 11:42:28 PM »
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I wonder if Cooper went through any R&D like this guy did  :rofl:

.


hilarious!   :good post: :rofl: