Author Topic: General Questions About The Case  (Read 158502 times)

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6615
  • Thanked: 501 times
    • Project 305
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #15 on: December 07, 2014, 10:11:23 PM »
Quote
So here's a question I have that doesn't fit anywhere:


 Actually it could go under "Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case"

I believe the tie is a clue, and the tie is also evidence. they are in harmony together  :-*
 

Offline andrade1812

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 367
  • Thanked: 21 times
    • My Website
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #16 on: December 07, 2014, 10:23:05 PM »
...

 :-[

...

Technically, everything is a clue...
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #17 on: December 07, 2014, 11:23:34 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
So here's a question I have that doesn't fit anywhere:

Today ties aren't universal. Most people who wear ties regularly, knot them properly. I know of nobody who wears ties and mixes knotted and clip-on ties. The only people I know who wear clip-on ties are kids working as bus boys in restaurants.

When ties were more universal, did people regularly buy both for convenience?

... and with that you have just nailed one of the reasons Himmelsbach thought/suggested... "he might be a food service worker". That along with Flo's comment he had olive skin and looked Latin to me.

I guess one of the questions is how much can you read into a clip on tie? Kids in highschool bands used to wear clip on ties. People in ROTC. Hell even FBI agents!  :) :) :) :) :) :) :)  My grandma wore one once - after opening grandpa's Christmas present by mistake!
 :) 
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 11:24:39 PM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6615
  • Thanked: 501 times
    • Project 305
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2014, 11:31:50 PM »
Quote
"he might be a food service worker".

Very polite, and tipped well too!!! ;D
 

Offline andrade1812

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 367
  • Thanked: 21 times
    • My Website
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2014, 11:36:31 PM »
The tie has latent evidence like titanium, stuff from medication packing, match particles and other metals. So the tie didn't belong to a busboy who was milling pure titanium in the late 1960's. The tie's original owner wasn't a bartender. I don't think the tie picked up spiral titanium particles sitting in evidence. I guess it depends on how much faith you have in Tom Kaye, but his analysis is important. If he's right about the scarcity of pure titanium, then the tie has a big story to tell, not a small one.

To me, Kaye's evidence makes sense. If the guy was working in a shop machining parts from pure titanium, the owner would want a clip-on tie that wouldn't kill him if it got caught in a lathe.

If Cooper bought the tie at an estate sale, that still puts Cooper in one of a few regions where they had shops likes this.
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6615
  • Thanked: 501 times
    • Project 305
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2014, 11:43:31 PM »
You might want to swing over to the Tina Bar thread....Tom is here now... ;D
 

Offline andrade1812

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 367
  • Thanked: 21 times
    • My Website
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2014, 12:00:32 AM »
 :(

Now I have to read the Citizen Sleuths website again before I can go to bed.
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6615
  • Thanked: 501 times
    • Project 305
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2014, 12:03:25 AM »
I guess something came up. he left the building  :(

I'm sure he will return to answer some questions for us....hang in there  ;D
 

Robert99

  • Guest
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2014, 12:14:15 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
So here's a question I have that doesn't fit anywhere:

Today ties aren't universal. Most people who wear ties regularly, knot them properly. I know of nobody who wears ties and mixes knotted and clip-on ties. The only people I know who wear clip-on ties are kids working as bus boys in restaurants.

When ties were more universal, did people regularly buy both for convenience?

The answer to your last question is "no".  In the 1960s, clip-on ties could be bought in drug stores for two dollars or less.  Note:  I AM aware that Cooper's tie has been identified as a JC Penny product which is relatively upscale for such a thing.
 

Robert99

  • Guest
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2014, 12:22:56 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
The tie has latent evidence like titanium, stuff from medication packing, match particles and other metals. So the tie didn't belong to a busboy who was milling pure titanium in the late 1960's. The tie's original owner wasn't a bartender. I don't think the tie picked up spiral titanium particles sitting in evidence. I guess it depends on how much faith you have in Tom Kaye, but his analysis is important. If he's right about the scarcity of pure titanium, then the tie has a big story to tell, not a small one.

To me, Kaye's evidence makes sense. If the guy was working in a shop machining parts from pure titanium, the owner would want a clip-on tie that wouldn't kill him if it got caught in a lathe.

If Cooper bought the tie at an estate sale, that still puts Cooper in one of a few regions where they had shops likes this.

For ever picture you can produce of someone in a machine shop wearing a clip-on tie, Tom Kaye can produce a picture of a machine shop employee wearing a fully knotted tie.  So the machine shop illustration is basically a wash.

However, I can definitely understand why a policeman would wear one since it would be one less thing that the bad guys could grab during a fight.  I imagine that most field policewomen wear their hair in a bun for the same reason.
 

Offline nmiwrecks

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 394
  • Thanked: 3 times
    • MichiganMysteries.com
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #25 on: December 08, 2014, 12:49:50 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
For ever picture you can produce of someone in a machine shop wearing a clip-on tie, Tom Kaye can produce a picture of a machine shop employee wearing a fully knotted tie.  So the machine shop illustration is basically a wash.
Just a simple question that will hopefully inspire conversation with differing opinions: Were would the Cooper suspect have most likely built the briefcase bomb?  His workshop at his place of employment, or his apartment or motel room? 
"If you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always got." - Henry Ford
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3093
  • Thanked: 127 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2014, 02:49:40 AM »
Managing this site:

Some thoughts.

As this forum spreads out like the Platte River (an inch deep and a mile wide), it might behoove us to have one line of commentary that can be flagged as to its central theme. That way, when somebody wants to see all the goodies on titanium they can type that into a search engine and get the posts.

Shut-Man, can this sucker do dat?
 

Offline Parrotheadvol

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 344
  • Thanked: 30 times
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2014, 12:10:34 PM »
I've worn a tie 3 times in the last month (job interviews, been out of work since September). Before that, I can count on one hand the number of times I have worn a tie in the ten years previous. I can't even tie one. Cooper may have been someone like me and the clip on, needed for him to blend in, was simply the easier choice.
 

Robert99

  • Guest
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2014, 01:57:24 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
For ever picture you can produce of someone in a machine shop wearing a clip-on tie, Tom Kaye can produce a picture of a machine shop employee wearing a fully knotted tie.  So the machine shop illustration is basically a wash.
Just a simple question that will hopefully inspire conversation with differing opinions: Were would the Cooper suspect have most likely built the briefcase bomb?  His workshop at his place of employment, or his apartment or motel room?

If it can be done without getting this list placed on a terrorist watch list, just exactly what is involved in building a bomb such as Cooper claimed he had?  The only thing I remember being described by the people who actually saw it is that there was a battery, what was probably road flares, and a lot of wires with two of them having an exposed end.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2014, 01:58:09 PM by Robert99 »
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2014, 02:49:28 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
For ever picture you can produce of someone in a machine shop wearing a clip-on tie, Tom Kaye can produce a picture of a machine shop employee wearing a fully knotted tie.  So the machine shop illustration is basically a wash.
Just a simple question that will hopefully inspire conversation with differing opinions: Were would the Cooper suspect have most likely built the briefcase bomb?  His workshop at his place of employment, or his apartment or motel room?

If it can be done without getting this list placed on a terrorist watch list, just exactly what is involved in building a bomb such as Cooper claimed he had?  The only thing I remember being described by the people who actually saw it is that there was a battery, what was probably road flares, and a lot of wires with two of them having an exposed end.

By all accounts it was the illusion of a bomb - not a bomb. Road flares vs. dynamite. Of course it's all conjecture however flares can be seen in most weather conditions from a distance. Seems like a simple formula to me!

To someone with parachuting experience and a good grasp of where he is, based on eyes looking for lights, the only real hazard is the geography below. Once again it's a simple formula with the advantage to Cooper vs. those trying to find him somewhere wherever 'somewhere' is in the last five or fifteen minutes at 200 mph!

The advantage is definitely on Cooper's side.