Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
5 (12.2%)
25% Cooper lived
2 (4.9%)
35% Cooper lived.
1 (2.4%)
50% Cooper lived
9 (22%)
75% Cooper lived
8 (19.5%)
100 Cooper lived
16 (39%)

Total Members Voted: 36

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 321150 times)

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4905 on: October 11, 2019, 03:45:12 PM »
I dont know where to even begin with this!  Flyjack is trying to rewrite the history of the Cooper case.   Why? To what end?  Flyjack can't even read English and understand what it says. That much is 100% clear.

Flyjack is VERY insistent! 

Today FJ lists his 3 top money theories, but he purposefully omits the Dredging Theory! Some people will do anything to push their agenda to the top. And on the fourth day FLYJACK created Mankind! On the fifth day FLYJACK created ' Spain'!

FLYJACK also claims today:

"Is it reasonable to believe that after Cooper handed some ransom money to Tina and offered some to the other Stews that with $200,000 ransom money in his possession while preparing to don a parachute, giddy with excitement he reached into his pocket and offered the $18 drink change from hours earlier to the stews..  $6 each?? I think the story is BS, somebody is hiding something. "

This convoluted FLYJACK nonsense is not reasonable and it didnt happen. Tina's own testimony says:

"Mucklow recalls that at one time during the flight the hijacker had pulled some single bills from his pocket (change from a $20 he was given earlier for a drink he had purchased) and attempted to (give the bills back) to tip the girls on the crew. (He was told then they could not accept tips). So again, they declined in compliance with company policy.                   She says it was also about this time (after the money was delivered and he offered a bundle which she rejected)  she again offered the hijacker something to eat or drink, which he refused. She recalls that (other than the original bourbon he ordered when he first boarded and was served) he accepted no refreshments or food of any kind while he was on the aircraft."

The timeline is as plain as the nose on your face IF YOU CAN READ & UNDERSTAND ENGLISH!

There were four events in this order

(1) Cooper ordered a drink early in the flight and offered a tip to the person serving the drink. The tip was refused. (2) Money and chutes were brought in later. (3)  Tina and Cooper quipped about there being so much money and Tina asked could she have some as a joke. Cooper offered her one bundle and Tina refused. (4) After the money and chutes were in and the 'can I have some money' incident happened, Tina "offered the hijacker something to eat or drink, which he refused".

The drink and tip offer did not happened AFTER THE MONEY HAD BEEN BROUGHT IN! IT HAPPENED EARLIER IN THE FLIGHT.   

Why is this important?

I have no idea why this is important to FLYJACK. It is just one more instance of Flyjack screwing things up to suit his own fantasy then claiming it is correct, and he is the smartest person on the planet.

Its mashugana.
 
« Last Edit: October 11, 2019, 04:13:51 PM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3316
  • Thanked: 164 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4906 on: October 11, 2019, 05:40:16 PM »
Yiddish Update

    mashugana (Noun) -   nonsense, silliness, craziness, garbage (as in useless)

    mashugana (Noun) -   A person who is nonsensical, silly or crazy; a jackass
   
Origin: From משוגעןער

A more common usage, at least in New York, is "mishigas."

Mishigas, an alternative spelling of the Yiddish word meshugas, is defined as craziness. A teenager stealing his parents' car is an example of mishigas. YourDictionary definition and usage example. Copyright © 2018 by LoveToKnow Corp. Mar 21 2019

« Last Edit: October 11, 2019, 05:43:43 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 
The following users thanked this post: georger

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4907 on: October 11, 2019, 05:49:40 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Yiddish Update

    mashugana (Noun) -   nonsense, silliness, craziness, garbage (as in useless)

    mashugana (Noun) -   A person who is nonsensical, silly or crazy; a jackass
   
Origin: From משוגעןער

A more common usage, at least in New York, is "mishigas."

Mishigas, an alternative spelling of the Yiddish word meshugas, is defined as craziness. A teenager stealing his parents' car is an example of mishigas. YourDictionary definition and usage example. Copyright © 2018 by LoveToKnow Corp. Mar 21 2019

will post about the money packaging tonight - he didnt get the knapsack so set about improvising finally settling on the orig bank bag, according to Tina. Its all in those two interviews Tina did.  . . . todah. 
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7475
  • Thanked: 691 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4908 on: October 11, 2019, 06:01:06 PM »
Flo asked Cooper if he wanted anything to drink. he replied with a "bourbon & 7-up" and paid with a 20 dollar bill. she didn't have change so she told him once she made the rounds she would have change. he tried to tip them once the money arrived according to Flo.

Flo then states Cooper put the back chute on and then the sunglasses. this would imply all the stews seen him without glasses? it's suppose to be early in the flight he put them on. it's possible he took them off at some points or she misquoted herself.

Tina states he tried to tip them (singles from his pocket) during the flight and not after the money was on the plane.

Alice doesn't mention anything related to the money or tips.
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4909 on: October 12, 2019, 12:42:34 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Flo asked Cooper if he wanted anything to drink. he replied with a "bourbon & 7-up" and paid with a 20 dollar bill. she didn't have change so she told him once she made the rounds she would have change. he tried to tip them once the money arrived according to Flo.

Flo then states Cooper put the back chute on and then the sunglasses. this would imply all the stews seen him without glasses? it's suppose to be early in the flight he put them on. it's possible he took them off at some points or she misquoted herself.

Tina states he tried to tip them (singles from his pocket) during the flight and not after the money was on the plane.

Alice doesn't mention anything related to the money or tips.

Shutter: "Tina states he tried to tip them (singles from his pocket) during the flight and not after the money was on the plane. "


I have the same timeline. The normal routine was to offer drinks at the start of the flight, not near the end, not while on the ground with passengers being held in suspension unable to leave the plane .... with ransom money and chutes being hauled down the isle in front of passangers no less! There is no account which says: Pilot announced. 'We have been hijacked. Passengers are being held hostage and can't leave for a while. Anyone want drinks and cigars?'  That never happened!

But, Flyjack has replied saying it was Flo who served the drinks, not Tina? FJ has posted some document (a 302?) which says Cooper never offered a tip for his drink at all. Flyjack concludes, his words:

'Flo recalled events in chronological order, she mentioned that Cooper tried to offer money from the drink change to ALL stews after Flo handled the bag of money. '     But I dont see that in any document FJ has posted?

Flyjack then says:

The point here is that these stories are both incompatible and unbelievable. Cooper did NOT attempt a tip when he actually got his drink and the change. (At terminal) Flo indicated the attempted tip was after the money was delivered. (when passengers were being held hostage on the ground at Seattle) Why would Cooper tip all the stews later from drink change? $6 each??  It is hard to believe Tina would ask for ransom money, take it then hand it back claiming they can't accept gratuities.. Ransom money isn't a gratuity and she asked for it. One or both of these stories is false... they are incompatible. 
 
The theory is the tip refusal stories were an embellishment to cover for Cooper offering them all money and one or more of them may have taken it. " says Flyjack.

Georger says: "Maybe the cow did fly over the Moon". Maybe FLYJACK has no argument at all. 
« Last Edit: October 12, 2019, 02:43:26 AM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3316
  • Thanked: 164 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4910 on: October 12, 2019, 03:18:10 AM »
Add to this, testimony from the passengers that I've talked with that once the flight was delayed and they were circling Seattle, drinks were on the house. That ended after an hour or so when a couple of drunk passengers got into a fight - Row 10-12 as far as I can determine. No drinks after that.
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7475
  • Thanked: 691 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4911 on: October 12, 2019, 08:02:27 AM »
Flo served the drinks. I've never seen drinks or food served prior to takeoff. she apparently took the 20 and gave him the change back after she built up a till from serving others. prior to her statement about the tip she said Cooper was acting "childish" once he received the money. he acts like someone would who won the lottery. he starts acting like he has an endless amount and foolishly starts spending. 18 bucks is now chump change then offers part of the ransom.

Tina appears to have a different account recalling the discussion about the tip occurred sometime during the flight and before they landed. it's possible they are mixing up the events of the tip from the drinks and Cooper offering part of the ransom.
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4912 on: October 12, 2019, 03:53:42 PM »
Quick note - back later tonight.

We have NORJAK.  Now we have FLYJACK.  !   Which one is the airplane hijacking and which one will win?   :rofl:

All based on posts at DZ today. Its obvious  FLYJACK   is competing with the NORJAK story and has his own version of the hijacking.

This is exactly what I had feared would happen when people start pushing their suspects and their own versions of the DB Cooper hijacking story. Who do we believe! ?  Who do we follow - NORJAK vs. FLYJACK ?  :rofl:   

Here is just one example, in JACK'S own words, a true conspiracy theory:

Quote from FJ at DZ today:      "  ****Occam's razor,, we know two people handled the ransom money after it went onto the plane,, we also know that one of them went to a facility (a convent) a few miles upstream of TBAR in the late 70's. Finally, we know that 3 packets of bills matching the ransom money was discovered a few years later on TBAR."
   Each packet of bills was paper strapped and consisted of three rubber banded bundles.  :)

Takeaway: Cooper was a janitor at Tina's highschool and they had an affair. Cooper contacted Tina who was working for NWO and they conspired to do a hijacking. Tina can confirm her lover from highschool was none other than ___________________  who conducted other hijackings. Tina could break the DB Cooper case tomorrow if she would only come clean and . . . confess. FLYJACK has solved the DB Cooper case!   :rofl:

Today FLYJACK publicly accused Tina Mucklow of being in a conspiracy with FLYJACK'S suspect, to plan and conduct the DB Cooper hijacking.

You heard it first from FLYJACK at the Dropzone Sky Diving Cooper Forum.

FLYJACK is a genius.  :congrats:      Definitely on a par with Robert M Blevins.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2019, 04:14:32 PM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3316
  • Thanked: 164 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4913 on: October 12, 2019, 06:58:20 PM »
In defense of Tina

Since I refuse to go to the DZ, I can only follow what Georger has posted here about the inference about Tina being responsible for the money showing up at Tina Bar.

Tina was NOT in a convent when the money was working it's way - however that might be - to T-Bar. Her convent, Maria Regina, is in Eugene, Oregon, about 100 miles south of T-Bar. Rather, during the time in question Tina was in a long-term care medical facility in Gresham, Oregon, beginning about 1978 and continuing through 1979. She entered the convent in the spring of 1979 or 1980, dates vary according with whom one talks to. Tina would know of course, but she ain't talking at the moment.
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7475
  • Thanked: 691 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4914 on: October 12, 2019, 08:45:18 PM »
Would anyone here pull out a wallet and try to give me money. If I refused would you put it in your pocket or back in the wallet? the odds are Cooper put it right back into the bag. If I had a small amount of money and wanted to get rid of it I would burn it..problem solved. no evidence and nobody accidentally finding it..

People do funny things under stress. especially, f your life is on the line. I think Tina tried to put some positive into the situation and keep him calm.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2019, 08:54:21 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7475
  • Thanked: 691 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4915 on: October 12, 2019, 09:24:33 PM »
I don't think these stews would even bring the whole thing up to the FBI if they kept any of the money. Flyjack is basically saying they took the money and told the FBI they didn't? that's very dangerous and puts you in the spotlight. nobody would of known unless Cooper got caught and told the FBI. why tell them anything?

I would be scared if some of these people were on a jury....
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 12:43:53 AM by Shutter »
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4916 on: October 13, 2019, 11:29:16 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
I don't think these stews would even bring the whole thing up to the FBI if they kept any of the money. Flyjack is basically saying they took the money and told the FBI they didn't? that's very dangerous and puts you in the spotlight. nobody would of known unless Cooper got caught and told the FBI. why tell them anything?

I would be scared if some of these people were on a jury....

I dont think FLYJAK has a chance in hell of making Tina a pasty in the NORJAK case. As much as he might like to bring attention to himself. 

Sluggo's factoid was that the NWO routine was to serve drinks early in a flight soon after passengers had boarded ... and it took less than 30 mins turnaround for refueling and cleaning out the aircraft at each stop ... no drinks were served during hijackings with ransom wares being brought on board with passengers being held hostage  :o ;)

Maybe FLYJAK can fit a cobra attack into NORJAK ?

Parcels, packets, bundles, packages, straps .... all official tech banking terms at SeaFirst in 1971! Yodul layee hooooo! All people in the FBI and at NWO and all crew on 305 including Scotty, were familiar with SeaFirst banking terminology. They used only official banking terms in everything they ever said ...... since 3rd grade! Yodul layee hooooo!
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 11:35:44 PM by georger »
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4917 on: October 14, 2019, 01:47:32 PM »
FLYJAK comes clean!

In major announcements this morning, FLYJAK announced today that his whole "Tina was a crook conspiracy theory" comes from:  TOSAW! It's in Tosaw's book, he says. With one caveat:

"One slight clarification, Cooper (they claim) offered the drink tip after he received the ransom and after Tina took some and claimed to return it.. about 4 hours after he had the drink.."    according to Tosaw's time frame.

Who is "they"?  'They' will be explained in Act XVILV of the New World Order Opera.

FJ says: "This is just a theory, it isn't proven but it is better than most of the theories floating around, the ransom money packets Cooper offered the stews ended up at TBAR... Tosaw speculated that the "rejected" packets went into his overcoat landed in the Columbia and ended up at TBAR.  Perhaps there was another route... This theory applies to any Cooper suspect, it doesn't point to any specific suspect...."

Gah: This tab just crashed, but I feel so much better.  :rofl:

*  The FLYJAK issue of packets vs bundles vs shards vs shiefs vs leafs vs packages vs straps ... remains unsolved. No doubt this has some relationship to the Zodiak Killer code. Keep working Kooperkomandergeselschaft sleuths.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2019, 01:53:15 PM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7475
  • Thanked: 691 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4918 on: October 14, 2019, 02:25:51 PM »
This is how people get locked up that are innocent. several times in life I was falsely accused. the last time was a hit and run. it all "made sense" to them...

As I stated before, it makes no sense for Cooper to put the money in his pocket while holding the bag. one second the money is hanging off the stairs and "makes sense" and now Tina taking the money "makes sense". why in the hell would she even bring up the conversation if she took the money. she wasn't even in the area until the late 70's....if she really wanted to get rid of the money she would burn it...poof gone..
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1226
  • Thanked: 184 times
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #4919 on: October 14, 2019, 03:26:38 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
This is how people get locked up that are innocent. several times in life I was falsely accused. the last time was a hit and run. it all "made sense" to them...

As I stated before, it makes no sense for Cooper to put the money in his pocket while holding the bag. one second the money is hanging off the stairs and "makes sense" and now Tina taking the money "makes sense". why in the hell would she even bring up the conversation if she took the money. she wasn't even in the area until the late 70's....if she really wanted to get rid of the money she would burn it...poof gone..

Likewise maybe ' issues of packets vs bundles vs shards vs shiefs vs leafs vs packages vs straps ' is just a "THEORY" too? The words are there is various documents. People use all kinds of words for referring to the same thing. I seriously doubt FLYJAK's contention that Tina was some kind of expert using formal banking terminology; or FBI agents either. Likewise that she had some kind of love relationship with Hahnemann in high school? If he was ever a janitor at her highschool ? Or they even knew each other!?

I am betting all of this would be news to Tina Mucklow and she would just laugh it off. I wish I could see an actual transcript of her interview(s) with Tosaw. We know Tosaw made a number of leaps of faith and came out empty handed. On the other hand some of his investigations hit the nail on the head and he made important discoveries for his clients.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar!  I guess you dont know until you try and smoke it ?  ;D
« Last Edit: October 14, 2019, 03:28:59 PM by georger »